PITA in Wisconsin

[yachtsmanbill]

This gonna be a C&P from the HAMB. Im sure some guys read it but it pertains to all (most) here as well. My post just now is last at the end of 6 pages of chatter.   ws

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/wisconsin-fenderless-hot-rods-wisdot.1155706/

Just a little background here.. Ive been here since about 2012, kinda lurking, but still trying to observe. Ive had a few non fendered/hooded Model T Ford speedsters, old Harley bobbers, a 1972 GSX 455 Buick, and as of late, my newest is a 1964 Buick Special 2 door post. This guy came from gramma, with a V6 and a 3 on the tree. Its now sports a built 455 (actually 465 CI) Buick engine a Super T-10 4 speed. Fun to drive.
As it sits right now, I run an Edelhozer carb with 1 inch tall adapter to make up to my iron stock 455 Q-jet manifold. A custom air cleaner finishes it off. HOWEVER, its too tall to install a hood. Its getting a stock Q-jet this week and that will rectify the situation.
Yesterday we were driving around town and got stopped by a Wis. State Patrol motorcycle cop and issued a warning ticket. Hmmm. We had a lengthy chat about the entire issue of this thred. He's probably gonna read this today so Ill have to say HI!
Absolutely a gentleman, he informed me that the car was not in compliance with it not having a hood. The warning would suffice and to get a hood on it when I paint it this winter. I promised him I would comply. He's local to me in Two Rivers, Wi. and its a small town. Im sure to see him again and sure dont want trouble.
I just wanted to say that the cops have the last (albeit not final) word on the violation. The rat-rod guys do it, the street rod guys do it , and I get the paper work! The cop also mentioned he was probably the only WSP officer to write guys up.
This is merely food for thought. I cant plead ignorance of the law any more. Now I know for sure. Just not looking for trouble. BTW... I pay for TWO personalized plate for these guys at 100.00 per year PLUS for each! Bill in TR

[elagache]

Dear Bill and mid-60s Buick caregivers who have enough trouble just keeping their cars on the road,

Thanks for sharing your story.  There is a disturbing trend of laws being passed without an awareness apparently car enthusiasts.   Paris has effectively banned cars older than a certain age from the city limits without any exemption for classic or historic vehicles.  The premise in that case was to reduce air pollution, something that classic and collector cars don't significantly contribute to.

Does anybody know of an organization that is actively lobbying for the interest of enthusiasts of classic cars and hot-rods?  We sure need such a thing.

Cheers, Edouard 

[schlepcar]

You got me laughing a little on that one Bill(not at you,but hopefully with you),
 There is no problem with the officer arguing his point if that is what he wants to do. The EXACT same thing happened to me in 1985 when I was driving my ragged out 70 Chevelle SS that just got another junkyard motor installed.  Everybody back then knew these chevelles were just junk kids cars and when you see a kid you had to pull them over and scare them straight(that's how cops worked in my town). So,I had not bothered putting the hood on until I found out if it had good oil pressure and would go to work and back on the same five quarts of oil. Wouldn't you know it was a little loud and had no hood when Leo passed me(that was his real name...my uncle's friend). He saw it was me and explained that it is illegal to run around without the factory body parts unless they are removable as per design....ie,jeep doors,blazer or corvette hard tops,etc.... This was probably the nicest,most common sense,down to earth guy in Otisville,and only an idiot argues with any LEO. So,I just told him I would get it taken care of and did so fairly soon. He quite simply was doing his job....As for you young man....I would have liked to see the look on the officers face when he got up to the car and saw you were not 16. He had already pulled you over and now had to dig back in the memory file and explain WHY he pulled you over. I would not take it too personal because anybody might pull such a car over just to check it out. Factory cars are supposed to have factory panels,but I think you could get that warning a lot of times before anybody would actually care if you did anything to fix it.

[yachtsmanbill]

Factory cars are supposed to have factory panels,but I think you could get that warning a lot of times before anybody would actually care if you did anything to fix it.

Thats exactly the taste that was left in my mouth. No punning there. If however, the guy is having a bad day a week from now, it'll be "I told ya so..." and heres the court date. Johnny law don't scare me. I was street racing when this guy was a newborn. Besides an occasional blast, I behave, especially around town. No fears there and I dont drink and drive either. Just avoiding confrontation.  I know we've all run around hoodless/bumperless but not as a permanent display. Even the BADLASS is just for convenience to monitor a fresh motor. I am not trying to show it off. If that were the case, there'd be dual 4s with a blower on top.

Ed, keep reading the HAMB... there's 3 longg threds there with this being a hot potato. I havent been through 100% yet myself, but I sure do feel like calling my local congressman that I did vote for. Classic car shows and ownership is pretty big up here and constitutes a lot of tourism dollars in the nice months. I think that may have a bit of swaying power. Maybe?? Bill

[WkillGS]

Does anybody know of an organization that is actively lobbying for the interest of enthusiasts of classic cars and hot-rods?  We sure need such a thing.

Cheers, Edouard 

SEMA comes to mind.... Specialty Equipment Market Association. I can't think of many other organizations which have the members, money or clout to have a significant influence on our lawmakers. The AACA has over 50k members, and the PCA Porsche club has over 100k members. NSRA, NHRA?

Here in Pa, we've had a multitude of rules and regulations to follow, just like everywhere else. Most have some basis as a safety concern..... fuzzy dice hanging from a rear view mirror, stickers on the windows or large hood scoops can impair vision. Side exit exhaust or holes in body panels can allow exhaust gas to enter the passenger compartment, raised vehicles/bumpers impose a hazard to rear-end collisions.
Some regulations are needed to protect the innocent as well as protect the stupid/careless from themselves!

If your car is tagged as an antique or hot rod it may have some equipment allowances compared to a daily use vehicle. Your state may vary.
 

[elagache]

Dear Dan, Bill, Walt, and mid-60s Buick caregivers,

On a similar vein as the actions of the Paris city government there is an ominous recommendation coming out of the British.  Here is the Hagerty's article about it.

https://www.hagerty.com/articles-videos/articles/2019/08/23/uk-committee-recommends-banning-private-vehicles-by-2050

The first paragraph has all the disconcerting news:

"Car enthusiasts in the UK are concerned about a report from a bipartisan select committee of Parliament that effectively calls for eliminating private automobiles and trucks by the year 2050—battery electrics and fuel cell vehicles included—to achieve the goal of making Britain carbon-neutral. The Science and Technology Select Committee report also says that the ban on combustion-powered cars and hybrids should be accelerated to 2035 from 2040."

What I find especially alarming is the myopic focus on one probably dubious issue: "carbon neutrality," when the effects on society are likely to be extremely devastating.  The science is increasingly clear that the amount of greenhouse gases already in the atmosphere has exceeded the tipping point, so reducing emissions isn't enough.  We are in the dicey realm of climate engineering.  On the other hand, I don't think any law-maker has any idea of the economic or social implications of taking away everybody's personal transportation.

If these sorts of issues are really being ignored, those of us with classic and collector vehicles are going to have an extremely difficult time being heard.

Oh well, . . . . Edouard   

[yachtsmanbill]

Hey Ed... I got a dose of man's inhumility to man this week. They'll ban internal combustion transport (carbon neutral ?? Thats a new newspeak term) while the chinaman keeps pumping out tons and tons of aftermarket non compliant HORREY four barrel carbs. Eat flies... ten billion chinamen cant be WONG ... haha...   Bill

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=Nv5mXarjE4b6-gS1sK64Cg&q=newspeak+1984&oq=NEWSPEAK&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0l10.3487.6613..9774...0.0..0.149.1160.0j9......0....1..gws-wiz.....10..35i39j0i67j0i131j0i131i67.9KqNUotezLs

[option B9]

  Hi everyone, Yes this is a very hot topic. Global warming, clean air, clean water.There will be big changes made. We might not see it but our children most definitely will in one way or another. we have made great strides in cleaning up what comes out the tailpipes of our cars, trucks and buses. very rarely do I ever see blue or black smoke belching out of a tail pipe of a modern vehicle. And the last time I did it was a high end import not an american car !!
   As car collectors/hobbyist we keep our vehicles running a peak performance and keep the fluid leaks to a minimum so our impact on the environment is very little compared to other countries that allow the use of two cycle scooters to roam the streets belching out clouds of blue/black smoke polluting the air and stain the buildings. In a trip to Europe I was shocked on how poor the air quality was, and no one seems to really care. This may sound strange but I rather be back in NYC, Yes the air is cleaner here !!   I can go on about our vehicles being low impact, but we all know our Buick's and how they are part of our families.   I will just say "watch out for non collector/Hobbyist people making crazy laws against us" . We are not the problem... We pump hundreds of millions dollars into the economy each year. Leave us alone !!

                                                                                       Tony                                                                          

[GreatScat1965]

 "We're so self-important. So self-important. Everybody's going to save something now. "Save the trees, save the bees, save the whales, save those snails." And the greatest arrogance of all: save the planet. What? Are these fucking people kidding me? Save the planet, we don't even know how to take care of ourselves yet. We haven't learned how to care for one another, we're gonna save the fucking planet? I'm getting tired of that shit. Tired of that shit. I'm tired of fucking Earth Day, I'm tired of these self-righteous environmentalists, these white, bourgeois liberals who think the only thing wrong with this country is there aren't enough bicycle paths. People trying to make the world save for their Volvos. Besides, environmentalists don't give a shit about the planet. They don't care about the planet. Not in the abstract they don't. Not in the abstract they don't. You know what they're interested in? A clean place to live. Their own habitat. They're worried that some day in the future, they might be personally inconvenienced. Narrow, unenlightened self-interest doesn't impress me. Besides, there is nothing wrong with the planet. Nothing wrong with the planet. The planet is fine. The PEOPLE are fucked. Difference. Difference. The planet is fine. Compared to the people, the planet is doing great. Been here four and a half billion years. Did you ever think about the arithmetic? The planet has been here four and a half billion years. We've been here, what, a hundred thousand? Maybe two hundred thousand? And we've only been engaged in heavy industry for a little over two hundred years. Two hundred years versus four and a half billion. And we have the CONCEIT to think that somehow we're a threat? That somehow we're gonna put in jeopardy this beautiful little blue-green ball that's just a-floatin' around the sun? The planet has been through a lot worse than us. Been through all kinds of things worse than us. Been through earthquakes, volcanoes, plate tectonics, continental drift, solar flares, sun spots, magnetic storms, the magnetic reversal of the poles...hundreds of thousands of years of bombardment by comets and asteroids and meteors, worlwide floods, tidal waves, worldwide fires, erosion, cosmic rays, recurring ice ages...And we think some plastic bags, and some aluminum cans are going to make a difference? The planet...the planet...the plan...   The late George Carlin.

[yachtsmanbill]

Aint that the truth! After working in a coal fired power plant IN THE CITY, with a nuclear fleet 30 miles away, I got really frigged over all the bunny huggers crying about pollution while enjoying their air conditioned or heated, well lit personal space. Blast the suburbans, get a Tesla, wheres the other end of the plug go?

Granted, we arent the cleanest by a long shot, but you still dont see millions in a city wearing respirators. Im talking about Pacific Rim manufacturing with zero regard for air quality. People bathe, crap, and fish in the rivers they live on. Start with the obvious abusers before hitting us below the belt.

Do you realize that half of chinas' rail system is coal fired steam? Our trucking fleet has to have urea treated diesel fuel to comply with a 10 minute idle shut down on a computer.

Diesel Exhaust Fluid (DEF) is an emissions control liquid required by modern diesel engines. It is injected into the exhaust stream. DEF is never added to diesel fuel. It is a non-hazardous solution of 32.5% urea in 67.5% de-ionized water.

The solution to pollution is dilution.   ws

[schlepcar]

I have several old cars and I drove one car 40 miles this year. The rest of them have been garage space polluters that provide extra dollars for the local assessor when determining local property tax value. This property value is then distributed to the local school district to educate children that I do not know or have. These children are then brainwashed/educated into thinking that the guy who just paid for the pool that they are afraid to swim in(because there are bullies everywhere,especially in the pool,or under your bed)has somehow ruined their future chances of swimming in a clean lake(that they could have done without the three idiot parents that wanted taxes raised to pay for the pool)because he spends a lot of his time working on smog polluting,gas guzzling,cars that he never has time to drive because he has to keep them ahead of the rest of the world as far as being employable,productive members of society. Without these productive,employable members of society there would be a large national deficit and very difficult trade relations with the rest of the world. So far the whole educational process and fending off of bullies has only added to the list people who are the REAL problem. As old car people we were eventually going to make that list....don?t worry the list grows daily to those who have time to cast the first stone.

[yachtsmanbill]

It all starts sooo young... Pat has a bunch of grandkids, and my progeny number is ZERO. Tonight she has to go with one kid, her sons,and the kids parents to kindeygarden at 6 pm for "orientation". Really??  When I had just turned 5 my mom pulled up to the K-building in her '60 Rambler wagon and said "Go up those stairs and turn right. Ill be back in 4 hours".  Thats how WE did it.

The other one was a graduation party... honest, with cap and gowns for K-garden. Too bad they didnt surprise the 5 y.o. with a new beemer. ??? What the hell have we become???

I need to shake your hand!   Bill

[TrunkMonkey]

Yeah. Snowflakes for certain.

I remember riding the bus to kindergarten, and watching the "Duck and Cover" flicks.

One of the lines that stuck with me:

"...There might not be any grown ups around when the bomb goes off. Then... you're on your own!..."

That will get you to sit up straight and mind your manners!

Thank God for graham crackers, milk and a mat.

[schlepcar]

Lol....we went from walking to school,to walking to the bus stop,to walking to the road and waiting for the bus that makes the whole world stop for us. I bet those of us that walked to school or rode a bike learned very quickly that you only have to be wrong once when it comes to heavy moving objects. When kids get off the bus now they just walk without even looking...the simplest of lessons such as ?look before you leap? or ?Don?t put all your eggs in one basket? or my favorite ?The boy who cried wolf?....may be lost to boomers who did not want to hurt anyone?s self esteem. A guy stopped yesterday with his son and his friend. It was very easy to tell that one was not his....I simply said he should leave him a couple days and I would get his ears clean for him. After listening to the 30 minutes of negotiations...I finally told the kid that he could go sit in the truck NOW..or I could arrange it to where sitting would be a sore subject. They finally all left so I could get back to work.

[yachtsmanbill]

GEEZ! In K-garden we had a cop safety officer give us a class on bicycle safety. FIVE LOUSY YEARS OLD! Got a diploma to prove we passed. Orange cones and right of way stuff. We road bikes 2 miles to the school. Nowadays, thats child endangerment and lock up the parents for neglect. Getting off the bus and flipping the text-o-graph on the last step gets me too. Like a 10 year old needs to confer with the brain surgery team at the Mayo. It all started with our generations' offspring. Now look where we're at...   Bill

Do busses have power ports instead of seat belts yet??? Hate to have a dumb fone go dead after the carotid artery gets moved outa the way for the tumor removal...