clutch pressure question

[kcombs]

I am trying to decide if I want to keep the four speed (or five speed) in my 65 GS Bucamino. (Currently an El Camino body on a GS frame.) I would love to eventually have a five speed car, but I went out to the shop the other day and I started the old nailhead up and got a cramp in my leg just backing it out. This thing has a really stiff clutch pedal and I am wondering if that is normal for a 65 GS four speed? I don't  know the history of the car so I don't know if it has a heavy duty pressure plate or if it is stock. Comments appreciated.

[jmos4]

Hi,

I've not had a stock pressure plate, but currently running a centerforce dual friction in my Skylark and the pressure is a little on the stiff side but not bad.
It is a little harder than my 300 powered 4 door which I believe also has a centerforce in it.

If you do go to change the clutch setup there are a few things to note, if you use a centerforce clutch you will either have to shim out the pressure plate or as i did was lengthen the lower release rod clevis believe I did it by remaking the end with a bolt and plate steel adding 1.25 inch over the stock one, seems to work fine. 

Somewhere in either this site or V8 buick there is a write up on the correct presure plate height which may be something you want to check to what ever you put in or you will have to play to get the clutch to disengage.

Hey I have seen your story on the Bucamino do you have any pictures or them posted somewhere would be neat to see, and you ever thought of changing the sheet metal to Buick and make something the factory might have?

well good luck,
Jim

[kcombs]

Hi Jim,

Why didn't Buick build a gentleman's GS Bucamino? I have the following parts collected over many years and much $$$ for just such a project. A 65 shorty Special wagon, two door post sedan, three 65-67 El Camino Bodies, numberous door from El Caminos and two door sedans, two El Camino frames, a NOS wagon quarter panel, and lots of other parts. I also have a running 65 Skylark GE four speed frame and complete drivetrain that is in running condition that has a fairly nice 65 El Camino body on it. The El Camino has new paint and chrome 15x7 rims and brand new tires. I just completely rebuilt the front end, added disc brakes and quick ratio power steering.

I plan on driving the current Elky while build the new body. I keep hesitating about what to build on what and where to start cutting, but this summer it is a go. The quarter panels from a Buick Sportwagon will fit on the Elky if you include the out fender wells. The patch panel from the quarter panel to the door can be a four door rear door skin or the front part of a two door quarter panel. I will use the window channel from an Elky on a Skylark door and it bolts right up. Roof and back glass and panels to the floor will be Elky. Tailgate will be Elky as will of course be the bed floor. The only piece I have to fabricate is the filler behind the door at the roof post.


More to follow

[kcombs]

More on building the Bucamino. I am trying to keep the project all 65 GM. Plain and barebones. Little chrome (fender ports???), radio delete, back-up light delete, no console, Stock four barrel, four speed, bucket seats, no a/c, steel rims (not decided on that), factory color, GS badges, and only modifications we would have considered "factory" in the sixties such as a rear sway bar.

If I can deal with the clutch pressure I would of course prefer a five speed tranny, but I will have to use an auto if it is not something I can resolve. If I go with an auto I have to bend my rules and use an aftermarket shift (bad thing) or a column shift (crummy to shift).

Having been a fabricator for many years, I believe in buiding and resolving issues and then disassembling for rebuilding parts and painting. So I am going to build the body on a frame and then lift it off and set it on the restored frame it will live on after it is painted. I will then reassemble with new and reconditioned parts. Color will probably be blue/blue or burgundy/black.

[jmos4]

Kurt,

I like the sounds of your plan, like I said would love to watch the progress, I saw a 2 door wagon on My Classic car a few weeks ago was kind of along what I imagine what your project will end up, of course with a bed and Elcamino rear window and roofline. you might even be able to reskin the tailgate with a Buick wagon one either way neat to see how it will evolves

Do you drive the car alot ,as I can not imagine replacing the manual trans set-up with a auto, although if you do. let me know as I do have a factory auto console and shifter and some linkage, electrical harness sitting around, maybe you might want to trade set-ups along with me adding some $$ as I now have 2 nailheads and a few cars so another 4 speed car would be neat.

Another option for you might be go to a hydraulic throwout as that may soften up the pedal I believe someone here had some pic listed here showing one

Good luck with the project again it sounds neat, lots of work but will be well worth it in the long run,

[kcombs]

Thanks for the encouragement! I just need to talk to someone who has a four speed setup, can't image that this thing was this stiff out of the factory. But in the sixties my legs were a little stronger so I can't go by my memory. However, I am not disabled in the leg department, but I do tend to get night cramps that really hurt. Don't want a setup that would trigger a cramp! For those of you that have never had one just image someone stuck you with a knife in the calf of your leg and then they are turning the blade for more pain...... scares the pee out of my wife as I roll around in pain.

[jmos4]

Kurt,

I can understand the leg cramp thing had a few in the past, here is a few things for thought..

Stock Pressure plate is a 3 finger design which most that I have had on other vehicles are rather stiff,
Most aftermarket clutches are of a Diaphragm design and a little lighter on the pedal unless it is a full race clutch
Centerforce Dual Friction pressure plates are of a Diaphragm design and also incorporate a bunch of weights that I believe results into not having a real stiff pedal at idle
I have also seen newer multi disc clutches where they have 2 or more discs not sure if it is available for the Nailhead, but imagine would work just need to have a flywheel redrilled and get one for a GM application may have to mess with linkage to get to disengage etc...

Like I said can not wait to see your project underway will be rather neat

Good luck maybe someone here who is still running a stock setup will chime in, but I can say I do not have any complaints running the centerforce on my 401 although it did get a little monotonous stuck in the Woodward Dream Cruise last summer although I would feel that way with my Manual trans Dodge as well (took 3 hours to go 3 miles at least a lot of eye candy)

good luck again,

[WkillGS]

It's been over 5 years since I had a stock setup in, but I don't recall it having a stiff pedal. Both my 65 and 66 4spd cars had diaphram spring pressure plates by the time I got them.
   I'm using a Centerforce dual friction in my 300/5spd '66 Special. I really like it.
   My 66 GS 401/5spd ended up with a Zoom street/strip setup that is uncomfortably stiff. It's the same # as a big block chev setup, it came with the trans as a package deal. I may be swapping that clutch out.
   Mark and Brian posted over on V8Buick years ago about a LuK Repset part number 04-049. Maybe they'll chime in with their reviews.  I have heard Luk is one of the largest manufactures of clutches and is the actual manufacturer for some of the aftermarket brands.