Author Topic: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455  (Read 18598 times)

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Offline yachtsmanbill

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #510 on: May 29, 2019, 06:14:38 PM »
"Id rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal LOBOTOMY"....Jack Baselski, 1978

Well now, where to begin. Attitude. Got up today feeling positive about life and a gas tank repair. Had some coffee and kicked the dogs and gave them all their CDB treats. We all have old bones all of a sudden.

Get out to the shop to finally examine the tank up close and personal. Now follow closely:
This tank had a "hole" punched in it (probably with a water buffalo horn) that was "close" to the pipe diameter. The pipe going in at an angle to the tank presented a wider than desired gap. For those of yooz that have swapped OEM necks out, the pipe has either a flange, or a rolled "nib" in the steel to perform the solder joint. This is a pipe in a hole.

First off, if this were a domestic tank, I'd say it was shipped with a film of cosmoline. This thing was globbed with YAK FAT. The solder that was used is much harder than 60/40 and really looks like an aluminum repair with a propane torch rod sold on TV.

Being chinasteel, the material is junk (by US standards) dirty low grade material. Combined with the YAK FAT, it was impossible to clean (solder wise). My hands were absolutely BLACK from handling this guy, and I ended up with a clean rag and MEK to clean it up. Its still has a "filmy" feel to it. The rag looked like I wiped the black overspray off the floor. WHAT CRAPPY MATERIAL!
I probably shouldve taken the pipe OUT, cleaned it and began from scratch, but an initial fit up proved its location was pretty close to spot on. I decided to go ahead and make the repair.

If youve ever sweated copper pipe, you can appreciate the cleaning, sanding (or wire brush scrubbing, and a clean solder and good flux) for a good job. I went so far as to touch a pencil point burr into the groove to clean any galvanizing out 1/2" of either side of the repair, washed it 5X with brake cleaner and a wire brush, and blew it clean with clean air. I was using a propane torch (Im outa MAPP) and tried several fluxes (all industrial stuff) and tried 5/32 60/40 acid core, resin core, straight lead, and lead free solders and nothing would tin the parent metal. I even pulled out "Excalibur" my 500 watt electric iron, cleaned with a special cleaning block and tinned with clean solder and was only able to get an "acceptable" closure on the gap to about 75%. I ended up with 1/2lb of solder rolling around inside the tank. That was all stuck to YAK FAT inside the tank. What a pisser to clean!

So with a 75% seal and some decent drops that tinned to the gap, I ended up doing a cold repair with JB weld. I hate doing things like an amatuer, but 3 hours on a pipe sweat and I was at my limit. The JB started to get like "plastic" so I installed the tank AGAIN to verify placement. It was still spot on. I did increase the carriage bolt length from 3" to 4" for ease of nutting. Its pulled up 100% and curing overnight.

While going to the hardware store (Thank God for standard GM fasteners!!) my new SS sending unit showed up. Three days early. Tomorrow, Im gonna pull the tank down and install the sender, and pressure test the tank with 5 psi of air. Im also gonna replace the 5/16 frame pipe with 3/8. The OEM pipe is pretty soft from rust anyway.

If you look at the vent pipe, you can see the aluminum torch rod type of weld. I did blow the vent hose and its 100% clear.

Im not sure what kind of JU-JU the witch doctor uses in china, but I do know that if a gulag inmate takes 3 hours on a job like this, it would mean his last bowl of rice! Pretty good story huh???

So the filler is rigid and seems sealed pretty well. I hope the judges dont drop the plate and inspect the filler neck and sting me 10 points HA HA!   Bill

« Last Edit: May 29, 2019, 06:25:39 PM by yachtsmanbill »
Nothing comes alive like a 455 !

Offline elagache

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But you forgot . . . . . (Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455)
« Reply #511 on: May 30, 2019, 03:56:21 PM »
Dear Bill and mid-60s Buick caregivers,

. . . .
Well now, where to begin. Attitude. Got up today feeling positive about life and a gas tank repair.
. . . .

I even pulled out "Excalibur" my 500 watt electric iron, cleaned with a special cleaning block and tinned with clean solder and was only able to get an "acceptable" closure on the gap to about 75%.

. . . .

So with a 75% seal and some decent drops that tinned to the gap, I ended up doing a cold repair with JB weld.
. . . .

 Its pulled up 100% and curing overnight.


Well now that was quite a struggle!

. . .  But wait!  You left the filler spout at the back!  Don't you know that . . . . . . . Silly me, I forgot you don't have a wagon! . . . . . . . . . .

Seriously congratulations on a difficult repair.  At least you have the satisfaction of getting a tank from d'em chinamen for only the cost of your labor!

Cheers, Edouard  :occasion14:

Offline yachtsmanbill

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #512 on: May 30, 2019, 04:33:05 PM »
Ya big dummy LOL... I was all set to finish the rear assault today but ran into a hitch(?).  The past few days Ive had a sore cyst in the small of my back. Ive had this thing for 50 years. About the size of 1/2 of a small pea. Its uncomfortable to slide into my truck and even to sit and lean against it. Today I got up at 0300hrs and it was killing me. By 0630 I was on my way to the walk in clinic. The Doc there took one look and  said it popped and was infected. My back looked like I took a line drive from a softball. Hmmm. She referred me to a surgeon at the hospital, same network.

I grabbed a few pics while the coffee was cooking and a selfie back shot at 3 a.m. is kinda tough.

They open at 0800 and could get me in to see the sturgeon at 0850. By that time the doc was prepping for a local and a #12 needle to empty the sack! Jizz was sent to pathology. Cant be too careful anymore.  By 0915 I was on my way home. Back is sore as heck and he recommended a day of heat of which I gladly obliged. I had to take care of it for ME, and when Pat gets home Sunday, she's gonna be flying low for her spinal surgery Monday afternoon. No driving for 9 days for her.

Two OXY's and a sulfa based antibiotic and Im already on the road to Wellsville. I sooo wanted to take Berty out for a spin today! Maybe tomorrow. 

Forgot to ad that i got this in the mail yesterday. "Twas 9.99 plus 3.00 for the envelope. Still has POOR seatbelt instructions.    Bill



« Last Edit: May 31, 2019, 03:58:21 PM by yachtsmanbill »
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Offline yachtsmanbill

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #513 on: May 31, 2019, 05:34:12 PM »
Got the tank down, assembled and pressure tested with soapy water @ 3-5 psi. Its all good. The I had to wrestle the Anaconda. It was a brutal fight but I won. A few bites but none the worse for wear. I put a 1/4" stud into the old and the new pipes and PUSHED the new stuff through. Im right where I wanted to be for today.   Bill

Nothing comes alive like a 455 !

Offline elagache

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Dear Bill and mid-60s Buick caregivers . . . . who occasionally need caregivers of our own!

Ya big dummy LOL... I was all set to finish the rear assault today but ran into a hitch(?). 

So sorry about the medical issues.  Glad you were quickly on the mend.  For a second there I thought you had found a hitch on the 'Lark.  At least that could have been potentially useful!  :laughing7:

Forgot to ad that i got this in the mail yesterday. "Twas 9.99 plus 3.00 for the envelope. Still has POOR seatbelt instructions.    Bill

Think of it as "entertaining fiction" . . . sort of like seed catalogs mailed the 15th of January! . . . :laughing7:

Got the tank down, assembled and pressure tested with soapy water @ 3-5 psi. Its all good. The I had to wrestle the Anaconda. It was a brutal fight but I won. A few bites but none the worse for wear.

Glad you are one step closer to cruisin'! . . . .  :hello2:

Cheers, Edouard  :occasion14:

Offline yachtsmanbill

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #515 on: June 01, 2019, 05:55:41 PM »
Thanks for reading this stuff Ed! Sometimes its drivel, sometimes it a story or a rant, but its always the truth.

Got the new tank totally installed WAHOOO!!! Finished up the new fuel line to the pump. Pulled the battery out of the 72 XGS and cleared the prop and... NADA. The bastard wouldnt so much as fart. A few drops of gas down the carb and it fired right up; for a few seconds. I figured the whole system needed to re-prime. I did the force feed a few times and finally stayed running, but really lousy. Let it warm up for almost an hour. FINALLY got rid of the stench of the burning old gas, WHEW!! The new T stat and gage gave me 175F, so thats good.

It ended up stalling but good after a few revs, Had to prime it again with less than stellar results. Managed to get it to run long enough where it would stumble but keep running. Shut it down and put a pressure gage off the fuel supply to the carb. Got right around 3.75 psi. Hmm The good book says 4.5 lbs MINIMUM. Took the gage off and put a hose onto it into a coffee can for the "flow test" and not even a drop of gas from the pump. The pump came on the burned up 455 when I got it so who knows its' history. I ordered a new one for tomorrow morning.

A few questions for those "In the know".  All the pumps have provisions for a return line. I have my 72 capped off and its OK. All the BBC & SBC chevies Ive had didnt use a return line. So is this a problem? I really dont want to run another pipe to the back... Im piped out!

Second, as an FYI, I put 5 gallons of fresh gas into a 20 gallon tank and the gas gage read 1/4 tank. If I can get this thing going tomorrow, Ill make a trip to Crack Trip for some non booze premium and mark the half and 3/4 levels for a comp.    Bill
Nothing comes alive like a 455 !

Offline Dr Frankenbuick

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #516 on: June 01, 2019, 06:20:50 PM »
Bill, The return line was for AC cars to prevent vapor lock.

Offline yachtsmanbill

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #517 on: June 01, 2019, 06:41:02 PM »
Thanks DOC!!  AH HA!!! So just cap it off? The ID is only about 1/16".   Bill
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Offline elagache

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Have they been properly introduced? (Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455)
« Reply #518 on: June 02, 2019, 02:25:46 PM »
Dear Bill, Good Dr., and mid-60s Buick caregivers,

Thanks for reading this stuff Ed! Sometimes its drivel, sometimes it a story or a rant, but its always the truth.


However, when it comes to the replies . . . . . . . . . . Remember!  You're askin' for it! . . . . .

. . . . Pulled the battery out of the 72 XGS and cleared the prop and... NADA. . . .


. . . . For shame Bill!! You haven't even properly introduced these siblings and now you are stealing parts from one to make the other work!  . . . . You are setting up a serious sibling rivalry if I ever saw one! . . . .

. . . It ended up stalling but good after a few revs, Had to prime it again with less than stellar results. Managed to get it to run long enough where it would stumble but keep running.  . . .


. . . .  Hmm, not sure what to tell you.  First, do you have the correct cable to hook up your laptop to the ECU?  If so, check to see if the air-fuel ratio is correct.  Perhaps your oxygen sensor is off, or perhaps the manifold vacuum pressure sensor . . . . . .

. . . . . Yeah, I know.  With friends like me you don't need any enemies!!

Cheers, Edouard  :occasion14:

Offline yachtsmanbill

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #519 on: June 02, 2019, 05:04:27 PM »
I changed the stoichiometric ratio, by 11% at 500Ft. above sea level or, 29.93in.Hg at bAr and that seemed to cure the EGT readout at WOT. The EGT is now at a juicy 985 at full flow. MAP is minus 19# absolute, and steady.

Just having Bertha adopted, BAD LAD was willing to share a few toys until we get over to the resale shop in town. Its the big brother thing to do for a swaddling sister.   A basic battery for well over 100.00 is just plain nuts!  Im gonna grab the generator battery off my boat and see if it'll take a charge.

So after putting in a new juice pumper today that cured a world of woes, but now she dont have the whoa to match the go. I changed out the second NEW master cylinder and finally tested it today. The others (all new!) leaked or would not build pressure to bleed.  This one I didnt research and found it to be for a disc brake car. Wrongo! This has the BIG/small reservoirs and the others were siamese.  Almost like no brakes. Actually like NO POWER and on one axle only. Felt kinda F'd up.

Tomorrow Pat has her spinal cord stimulator installed with a 100,000 mile warranty. She's just pulling up now from the Sunshine State and drove almost straight through. Boy, I sure am glad we have dogs that I need to stay home for to watch LOL. Gonna be busy for a few days, so pardonne ma poussire !  Bill   
« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 05:45:54 PM by yachtsmanbill »
Nothing comes alive like a 455 !

Offline elagache

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Glad BAD LAD is willing to share! (Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455)
« Reply #520 on: June 03, 2019, 03:15:37 PM »
Dear Bill and Buick owners with a growing family! . . . .

I changed the stoichiometric ratio, by 11% at 500Ft. above sea level or, 29.93in.Hg at bAr and that seemed to cure the EGT readout at WOT. The EGT is now at a juicy 985 at full flow. MAP is minus 19# absolute, and steady.


Uh, . . . . yeah . . . .  :icon_scratch:

Just having Bertha adopted, BAD LAD was willing to share a few toys until we get over to the resale shop in town. Its the big brother thing to do for a swaddling sister.   A basic battery for well over 100.00 is just plain nuts!  Im gonna grab the generator battery off my boat and see if it'll take a charge.


Well if they are getting along of course they can share!  :laughing7:

So after putting in a new juice pemper today that cured a world of woes, but now she dont have the whoa to match the go. I changed out the second NEW master cylinder and finally tested it today. The others (all new!) leaked or would not build pressure to bleed.  This one I didnt research and found it to be for a disc brake car. Wrongo! This has the BIG/small reservoirs and the others were siamese.  Almost like no brakes. Actually like NO POWER and on one axle only. Felt kinda F'd up.


Yes indeed, master cylinders for disk brakes won't work properly with drum brakes.  Even switching from disc/drum to 4-wheel disc brakes can cause "issuez."

Tomorrow Pat has her spinal cord stimulator installed with a 100,000 mile warranty.


. . . . Does that warranty include parts and labor? . . . .  :laughing7:

She's just pulling up now from the Sunshine State and drove almost straight through. Boy, I sure am glad we have dogs that I need to stay home for to watch LOL. Gonna be busy for a few days, so pardonne ma poussire !  Bill


Don't get French with me feller!  J'ai double nationalité!

Seriously, hope Pat's procedure goes well and that you'll be back working Bertha in no time!

Cheers, Edouard  :occasion14:

Offline GS66

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #521 on: June 03, 2019, 06:24:29 PM »
Always liked that plate BAD LAD!
Jim
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Offline yachtsmanbill

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #522 on: June 05, 2019, 06:08:53 PM »
Thanks Jim... A pal back in Illinois has a GNX with the tag BAD DAD.  There used to be a cartoon in the paper called "The further adventures of the Bad Lad". It was about a dork who tried to be a B.A. and always looked like the fool. Still trying to find a copy. That was 30 years ago.

So its been a few days. Pat survived the Florida trip. Four of her adult kids, their offspring (12 of them all under 13 y.o.) and a broken down 2008 dodge van (theirs) and 100*F in Tampa with 3.50 water bottles at Busch Gardens. I stay home to watch the dogs LOL... Her surgery, after a harrowing 24 hour drive and arriving sunday evening, was Monday afternoon. She's been pretty sore and has begun a rebound today. Thats cool. She's one tuff gal.

Had a chance to get in a little shop time today. Pulled the master cylinder off AGAIN and ordered another for tomorrow. Is the 4th time the charm??? I wish to hell they'd comp me on the brake fluid!
  Pulled the valve covers off to re-seal them with some Right Stuff. Decided to upgrade to the chrome ones that had been shelved for 4 years with < 1 hour on them. They leaked (repops) and now with some right stuff maybe not. We'll see. Picked up an Art Deco aluminum air cleaner for 40.00 The stoopid edelhosers' (hate to advertise for a 3rd rate company!!!) are as much or more. This guy is chinaluminum Im sure, but fits well and is polished on the ribs. It sits just as high as the stock 455 cleaner tho, so its a hole in the hood (maybe a 'glass 1964 skylark hood?? Hahaha) to clear this unit.
After lifting the port side cover, I remembered that I had chipped one of the rocker arm buttons. #1 port was turned sideways and the rocker was riding off center. Not too bad, but not correct. I ordered 4 more at .99 each. I guess pulling the covers was a blessing. Hafta wait for the parts tomorrow to finish closing it up. Maybe its gonna run better and not be a gusher this time. Ill settle for a "duster".

The gas tank pad is OEM ca. 1964, re-used, like new,  with no lousy build sheet underneath.    Bill



« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 06:30:03 PM by yachtsmanbill »
Nothing comes alive like a 455 !

Offline Brian

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #523 on: June 06, 2019, 11:06:08 AM »
Bill,
  Have you tried taking one of the master cylinders apart to see if the shipping preservative is causing your issues?  They are really simple to get apart--just keep track of the order everything goes back in.  I have found that a good cleaning of the guts with brake cleaner will make them work like they should.
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Offline yachtsmanbill

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Re: Secret experimental 1964 GX 455
« Reply #524 on: June 06, 2019, 12:15:01 PM »
YIKES! Never thought about cleaning with brake cleaner; Hmm... Will that clean YAK FAT as well?  Theres and LOL in there someplace! I can imagine if Wun Lung can do it so can I. Youd think that name brand stuff should adhere to some kind of quality control, especially on brake parts, no?
 Youdo present a valid point Brian. Im gonna toss this one in and if its a failure, Ill try the cleaning route. If that works fine, but if its DOA, I will change brands.

I did some research on the manufacturing process on MC's. The chinesium units are cast, machined, and honed (and "maybe" cleaned) prior to assembly. AC Delco, or Borg and Beck and all other domestic units were cast, machined and SHOT PEENED for a hardened finish before honing. Just another chinaman shortcut or oversight. I'll go for the initial remark. I promise this; Ill get the RAST RAFF on this job!  Bill
Nothing comes alive like a 455 !