Author Topic: Four General Restoration Questions  (Read 3044 times)

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Offline Robk

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Four General Restoration Questions
« on: July 13, 2009, 09:57:08 PM »
Hello Gang,
I am restoring a 65GS convertible with original 4spd that has more than its fair share of rust.  I also just bought a very low rust 65 lark (300) convertible for body parts etc. (trucking company to deliver later this week).  So here are my questions:

1.  Is the frame on the skylark convertible the same as the frame on my GS?

2.  Does anyone make the chrome edging that mounts on the floor at the shifter?

3.   Are 15x7's rally the correct size for a 65 GS.

4.  The skylark has working electric windows.  What do you guys thinks of putting these electric windows in my GS?

Thanks.    Rob Keena
65 Gran Sport Convertible 4 Speed

Offline Chris

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2009, 11:03:59 PM »
Bob.. welcome to the club! 

An original 4 speed convertible puts you in the elite 65 GS club that most of the rest of us just sit back and envy.    8)

Guys.. please feel free to correct me here if I tell Bob something wrong as I attempt to answer his questions.   ;D

1.  Is the frame on the skylark convertible the same as the frame on my GS? The frames are very close however the GS convertible has an extra reinforcing section on the rear cross member.  Once you have your body off the original frame you should be able to see the location of it.  It basically looks like an extra piece of metal in the shape of a triangle that reinforces the corners underneath.  You can have these fabricated for your new frame or harvest them from the old frame and moved over.  Of course because this is a four speed frame, you'll also need to harvest the Z bar bracket & pivot point for the pedals.  One other thing you'll want to take into consideration is the frame section on the drivers rear side where the serial number is stamped into the frame.  You can have this section replaced with the original if it's in good shape or have the numbers restamped (check your local laws about this).  This could become an issue if ignored during an inspection if the frame numbers don't match the rest of the car (especially if you need to have an out of state inspection).

2.  Does anyone make the chrome edging that mounts on the floor at the shifter? I don't know about this one.... anyone?  This might be something you'll need to find used and have refinished or you might luck out and find this NOS somewhere.

3.   Are 15x7's rally the correct size for a 65 GS.  This rally size is probably the most common upgrade since the 15's fill out the wheel wells more however for 65 the factory wheel (optional) were a 14" Rally rim that could accommodate either a 7.35" X 14" or 7.75" X 14" tire.

4.  The skylark has working electric windows.  What do you guys thinks of putting these electric windows in my GS?  Personally I'd upgrade.  It's actually kind of uncommon (but not really rare) for a Buick convertible to not have power windows as it was usually a preferred option to take the top down with all the windows from the comfort of the drivers seat.  Just keep in mind that you might also need new door panels for the front and back (might need them anyhow) because of the location of the manual window cranks.  Many restorations end up with more factory options that started on the car and this is typically not looked down upon as long as the options are convenience related and not performance.  Build the car to your liking but make sure to keep the documentation so when the time comes to sell it, you can represent it properly to the next owner.

Hope to see you around and again.. welcome aboard!

Chris
« Last Edit: July 13, 2009, 11:07:54 PM by Chris At 65GS »
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 1965 GS Coupe
 1983 Porsche 911 SC
 2000 Porsche 911
 2011 Lamborghini LP550-2

Offline Mark Ascher

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2009, 11:21:49 PM »
Rob,

Welcome!

Chris, I think all your answers are right on, the only thing I'd ask Rob about is the chrome edge for the shifter. Is it a console or non-console car?

Brian Stone can give plenty of insight into how to install PW into a non-PW car. It will absolutely need new door panels.

Mark
65 GS HT 4 Speed - BCA Senior 2015; AACA Senior Grand National 2021
66 Impala 396/TH400/12 Bolt "Project Rodent Remediation" - Almost Done
69 Bel Air 2 Door Sedan "Project Junior Stock" - In Process
19 Chev Silverado Pickem Up (daily driver)

Offline WkillGS

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2009, 10:05:19 AM »
1) Frame
     I didn't know about that one Chris! I tried to look at mine, but there's a car in the way (imagine that!)
     I'm comparing a 65 GS vert frame to a 66 vert frame.... the rear extension is boxed in on the GS frame, but mostly open on the Skylark frame.
    I've seen extra reinforcements on some 66 GS frames. The front crossmember has a reinforcement over the weld joint where it attaches to the side rails.
    Serial numbers are stamped in two locations. Also under the drivers door area, on top of the frame.
2) Shifter trim
    If you have a plain rubber boot, there was a flat stamped metal retainer that holds the boot to the floor. It's covered by a lip on the boot. Usually painted black. Chevelle repos are the same as this retainer, but zinc plated.
You best post a pic.
   
Walt K
Eastern Pa

66 GS Astro Blue/blue 425 auto
66 GS Silver Mist/black 401 4 spd
66 GS Flame Red/black 401 5 spd
66 GS Saddle Mist/black 401 L76 auto
66 Special Flame Red/black 300 5 spd
65 GS vert Verde Green/ Saddle buckets 401 4 spd
79 Turbo Regal

Offline Robk

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2009, 03:15:11 PM »
Gentlemen,

Thanks.  My GS frame is not too bad.  It just has a small problem area.  I'll stick with the GS frame to the keep the numbers in order since the skylark frame would require work anyway.

My shifter is very plain.  No console, just a boot which is held down by shiny metal  piece of trim. It Could be and add-on, but an old photo of a 4spd I saw made me think it was original.   I hesitate to call it "chrome" as I think it is simply unpainted light gauge metal.

I appreciate Chris's words about the 4spd convert.  It's good inspiration to keep going on this extensive restoration.  My car was a"barn find" but unfortunately a "leaky barn find".  My hope is to have it onto the streets of Minnesota by spring. 

I appreciate all the information  and  hopefully won't wear out my welcome with all my questions (and no answers) in the coming months.

65 Gran Sport Convertible 4 Speed

Offline Mark Ascher

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2009, 03:59:27 PM »
Rob,

The carpet ring for the shifter I think should be black, the paint just may have all come off. My car is also a no console car, so if you need any references, let me know. Looking forward to seeing the car progress! Post some pics if you get a chance.

Where are you in MN, I'd love to see it.

Mark
65 GS HT 4 Speed - BCA Senior 2015; AACA Senior Grand National 2021
66 Impala 396/TH400/12 Bolt "Project Rodent Remediation" - Almost Done
69 Bel Air 2 Door Sedan "Project Junior Stock" - In Process
19 Chev Silverado Pickem Up (daily driver)

Offline Loren At 65GS

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2009, 06:30:44 PM »
Chris and others concerned ,
GS rally wheels and the plain  steel wheel for GS , are 14 X 6" wide and take 7.75 tires.
The 14 X 6" wheel and 7.75 tire was also used on the Sportwagon as an option
Stock wheel for a Skylark was a 14 X 5" wide wheel and used the 6.50 or 7.35 tire. The 7.75 on a 14 X 6" wheel was an option for the Skylark, as were the rally wheels.
This info is from "1965 Buick features and facts" dealer info.
Loren
65 GS hardtop BCA Senior
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Offline Chris

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2009, 11:01:42 PM »
Thanks Loren.. I was hoping that someone would expand on the wheel and tire sizes in more detail.

This is good information to have.

Chris
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 1965 GS Coupe
 1983 Porsche 911 SC
 2000 Porsche 911
 2011 Lamborghini LP550-2

Offline Brian

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2009, 01:57:23 PM »
You can actually re-use the manual crank door panels--the switches go in the same location as the crank, and all you have to do is cut the round hole into a square hole for the window switch. 
  If you are going to have the car completely apart, definitely put in the PW.  But it has to come apart to do it right--crossover harness is mounted to the back side of the firewall up high under the dash, so everything has to be out of the dash to put it in correctly.  The holes for the wire boots between the doors and door jambs have to be drilled with the doors off of the car.  The holes in the door jab are two sizes (two layers of metal to go through) and the larger one is to the outside, so it has to be drilled from the outside with the door off.  Take lots of pictures of the wire and screw locations when you take it all out of the Skylark because you will need it when you go to install it all in the GS!   
  Make sure you take all the motors apart and clean/lubricate them well before putting them in the car--it is a major job to get one back out later if it has a problem. (requires removing the glass, and on the doors, requires removal of the vent window).
'64 Skylark 2dr ht 4 speed, 300-4
'65 GS ht, 4 speed,2-4s,AC,PS,PB,PW,Pseat,Tilt
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Offline Chris

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2009, 05:15:46 PM »
Thanks Brian.. I wasn't really sure about the door panels and the locations of the cranks vs. the postion of the window switches... this is good to know in the future.

Chris
-= A Howitzer with Windshield Wipers =-

 1965 GS Coupe
 1983 Porsche 911 SC
 2000 Porsche 911
 2011 Lamborghini LP550-2

Offline Robk

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2009, 11:41:20 AM »
Thanks guys.

The info on the wheels is very helpful.  Mine will need some work.

My GS is coming completely apart.  The motor is already out and in the process of rebuild and the rear clip will be replaced with the skylark rear clip.  Everything goes to make this a high end driver.

Unfortunately the power windows were already out of the skylark which arrived yesterday.  Sellers says they worked.  So I will have to figure out how best to get them in in my GS if I go that route.  Skylark came with three tail light assemblies with varying degree of pitting and  a variety of other parts I don't need.  If I had any idea on how to post photos, I would.

Mark- The car is in St. Paul

Rob Keena 
65 Gran Sport Convertible 4 Speed

Offline Mark Ascher

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #11 on: July 16, 2009, 01:05:55 PM »
Rob,

I'll send you a pm. I'm in St. Paul too.
If you click on the "Additional Options" arrow just below the window where you type a post,
It shows where you attach pics. Click "Browse", find the pic, click ok, and away you go.

Mark
65 GS HT 4 Speed - BCA Senior 2015; AACA Senior Grand National 2021
66 Impala 396/TH400/12 Bolt "Project Rodent Remediation" - Almost Done
69 Bel Air 2 Door Sedan "Project Junior Stock" - In Process
19 Chev Silverado Pickem Up (daily driver)

Offline Chris

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2009, 05:05:39 PM »
Rob,

I think I found the 4 Speed trim ring that you was looking for.

Year One claims to have "re-released" this part although like mentioned above, this is probably a Chevelle or other part that is shared with our beloved GS's.

http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/fbshopmain2.asp?input=shifter+trim&SM=1&SC=2

They claim that it's cadmium-plated like the original ??????

Not a bad price at $30 if it's actually the correct piece...

Chris
« Last Edit: July 21, 2009, 05:09:57 PM by Chris At 65GS »
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 1965 GS Coupe
 1983 Porsche 911 SC
 2000 Porsche 911
 2011 Lamborghini LP550-2

Offline WkillGS

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2009, 07:36:54 PM »
Same as the 64-66 Chevelle part.... Only $17.95 from Ground Up! ;D
Walt K
Eastern Pa

66 GS Astro Blue/blue 425 auto
66 GS Silver Mist/black 401 4 spd
66 GS Flame Red/black 401 5 spd
66 GS Saddle Mist/black 401 L76 auto
66 Special Flame Red/black 300 5 spd
65 GS vert Verde Green/ Saddle buckets 401 4 spd
79 Turbo Regal

Offline Robk

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Re: Four General Restoration Questions
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2009, 07:49:07 PM »
That's it!

Thanks
Rob K
65 Gran Sport Convertible 4 Speed