65GS.com - Buick Gran Sport Enthusiasts!
General Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Jonesy on August 09, 2012, 04:54:09 PM
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So, I've purchased my first 65 GS and I love it. I was invited to attend this years BCA event in Charlotte with the owner of this car. He and I drove another of his many Buicks, his 1962 Invicta convertible from South Florida to Charlotte with his wife following in another car. The night before we left, my wife and daughter dropped me off at their house so I could spend the night as we were getting on the road pretty early.
He and I were in his garage going through some of the paperwork on the GS and I was drooling over the car which I knew was to be mine very soon. I was behind the wheel in the drivers seat, and he in the passengers, when he removed what I recognized to be the original factory service manual from the glovebox. I immediately exclaimed "that's the service manual, open it to the back cover", and guess what we found?
Now, he's owned this car since 1988, 24 years, having purchased it from the third owner at Spring Carlisle in PA. In the back of that manual was the POP which has been in his possession all of this time. He had no idea. I took down the original owners name and address and went to bed on my I Phone doing an extensive internet search for the original owner whom we'll call, "Corky." I had no luck finding any contact info on him at all. But through a web-site called Geneology.com, I was able to find his family tree along with his siblings. Since I couldn't find anything on Corky I started searching for his siblings and was able to find who I beleived was his brother located in PA.
I went to sleep that night with the web page loaded on my phone and saved for another time. We woke early that next morning, got on the road for Charlotte, and encountered the remnants of a tropical wave/depression which gave us rain from South Florida to Jacksonville. From Jacksonville on it was absolutely beautiful and never rained again the entire trip up and back.
Once we arrived at the hotel in Charlotte, I met up with my dad who is a Buick retiree. He drove down from Flint and, both of us being tired from our respective trips, went to bed fairly early. The next morning, Thursday June 28th, I woke just before 7:00am and told my dad that I was going to call the number I had found in hopes of finding Corky. The phone was answered by a woman and I introduced myself apologetically for having called so early. I told her a bit of my story stating that I had recently purchased a 65 Buick GS which I thought may have possibly belonged to "your husbands brother?"
Unbeknownst to me, a man had gotten on another phone and was listening to our conversation. When I was done with my story to the woman, he asks, "How do you spell the last name?". I told him the spelling of the last name and described the car and he tells me "I remember that car, it's my brothers old car." I asked if his brother was still alive, he tells me yes and gives me his cell number. He tells me to call right then because he's "probably on his way to work". I called "Corkys" number and get him on the phone.
You wouldn't believe how excited he was to know that his car was not only still on the road, but was a low mileage, mostly original car that had gone through very few owners after he sold it. We've had numerous conversations about his old car and I sent him a number of pictures showing it just the way it was when he purchased the car new at 21 years of age. This is some of his story. He purchased the car brand new on the dealership lot of a place named Bert Webber, Pontiac and Buick in Schaefferstown, PA. (The dealerships "badge"is still on the trunk lid today.)
He says that the dealership owner, Bert Webber Sr. was purchasing two 4-speed cars for his son, Bert Webber Jr. to drag race with. One was a 65 GTO and the other was this 65 GS. "Whichever car arrived at the dealership first was the car Jr. was going to use to race." The Goat showed up first so the GS went out to the back lot and sat for sale. When Corky found the car it took some work, and some time, in order for his dad to allow him to purchase it.
When his dad finally agreed Corky was 21 years old and told me he thought that the sticker on the car was somewhere around $3600.00 and change. He brought the car home in October of '65 and "drove the hell out of it" for the first year that he owned it. He said, "If there's any doubt as to whether or not that car has a posi rear end, I'm here to tell you that it most certainly does". Come fall of '66 Corky married his sweetheart, to whom he is still married today.
Now, she didn't drive when they married so Corky, being a farmer at the time and having a pick-up truck as well, put the GS in a barn and there she sat for the next 21 years. He said he drove the car sparingly all those years until he came to realize that it would do a new owner good to see the car get used again and so, he sold it. In comes Mr. Cortright. Corky was able to locate Mr. Cortright and found a phone number for him so I've been able to speak with Mr. Cortright. Mr. Cortright purchased the car in order to "flip it".
Mr. Cortright said that he's had a small used car dealership since 1972 and was "amazed" that he had found an all original, low mileage Buick GS 4-speed, in a barn, in his "backyard". Mr. Cortright purchased the car sometime in early '87, owned it for what we believe was less than 5 months, and sold it to Mr. "Lee". Now, Mr. Lee was extremely difficult to get ahold of. He was the missing piece in our puzzle because the title had his name on it when my friend purchased it, but my friend purchased it from a broker, at Spring Carlisle in PA, in 1988.
After a few weeks of internet searches and pay "people locator services" I was able to pinpoint his whereabouts. I put a letter in the mail, and about a week later I got a phone call while on shift at the fire station. Turns out Mr. Lee was a speed junky AND a 17 year volunteer firefighter in PA, so we hit if off immediately. His story is as follows. Mr. Lee purchased the car from Mr. Cortright in PA in 1987. He purchased the car "in pursuit of the fastest car I could get my hands on".
He said, at one point in his life, he went 7 months with no car payment because he just kept on trading cars in, one after another, trying to find the fastest car he could. He said he didn't own the GS for long, as best we can tell, less than 5 or 6 months. He traded the car in on a 1969 'vette to an auto broker named Jones Motor Cars in PA. Jones Motor Cars brokerage took the car to Spring Carlisle in 1988 and that's where my buddy found the car. He, my buddy, says that he and 2 other people offered the same amount of money for the car that day and that they were all told "no", it wasn't enough.
He was able to strike a deal a month or so later for $200.00 or $300.00 dollars more than they had offered at Carlisle. He bought the car in the spring of 88 and has had it garaged ever since. The car has just under 48,000 original miles. It's never been wrecked or repainted, the interior has never been out of the car and the drivetrain is all numbers matching. Corky said the only thing he ever had done to the car was having to replace the syncro in the tranny.
My buddy has had the radiator recored, an exhaust system put on although the tailpipes are the original from the factory. The rear passenger side window was replaced because a guy mowing his yard back in the late 80's or early 90's sent a rock into it breaking it. The tires and battery are not original to the car. He bought the car with 40 or 41,000 miles on it in 88 and has put very few on it since. Corky is beside himself knowing that the car is still intact and being driven by a die-hard Buick fan and hopes to one day get to drive it again.
He's 68 years old and still working in PA and is one of the nicest guys I have ever spoken to. That's my story, I known it's a long read but I thought someone here might enjoy it. I'm no Brian Stone and I know I have alot to learn about these cars, but I've been wanting a 4-speed 65 for awhile now and have finally obtained it. Wish me luck.
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Some pics of the car.
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It still has the original T3 headlights.
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No AC, manual drum brakes all around, power steering and Borg Warner T-10.
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More pics.
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A few more.
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The 401.
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Nailhead.
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Great story and a heck of a find. Thanks for the story and the pictures. How did you locate the car ?
Dan
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Dan,
I met the owner at a car show here in Stuart, Florida back in November of 2010. He had his 62 Invicta convertible there, and, being that you never see any Buicks at the local shows down here, I gravitated toward his car. He is 69 years old and has a number of Buicks. Very nice and knowledgable guy. I was telling him that night of how I wanted a 65 GS 4-speed, and that that was going to be my "next car". As we're talking, I'm pulling out my phone to show him some of the 65 GS's I had been watching on e-bay, and over my shoulder he says, "I have a 65 GS 4-speed." After 6 or 7 months of hanging out at the local shows with him I finally asked if he would ever sell the car. I expected to hear him say, "never." But he said, yes, he would sell it as he wants another T-Type limited. I told him that I would appreciate first right of refusal if and when the time came and he said okay. Months went by until one day he said he was ready to sell. We agreed on a price and then I went to work on my wife. We have a 70 GS 455 so she was rather reluctant at first. She finally agreed and we started saving a bit more before I was in a position to purchase it. Having found the POP and locating all of the previous owners was just icing on the proverbial cake. He, the previous owner, has always believed that the engine was not original to the car. If you look at the VIN stamp on the block, it was stamped at such an angle that you can't make out a single digit. Also, the code is an LT and not an LR so he always thought that it was out of a full size. It wasn't until we found the previous owners and spoke to each of them, and looked along the edge of the block a little closer, that we were able to determine that the driveline is original. In the center of the block lip, in between the LT code and the messed up VIN stamp we found a three digit number, it's 447, which matches the 447 on the POP. Bottom line, I got lucky, and even luckier finding this site and all of you dedicated to the preservation of these cars. I've already bothered Brian Stone about my 70 more than I care to admit. Thanks in advance for all of the responses I see forthcoming throughout the years as I start to work and replace things on this car.
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A few more pics.
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Very few signs of rust, just a bit beginning at the outer rear wheel well. It has a number of chips, scratches and dings but I'll be leaving it just the way it is until my 7 year old is out of college.
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The previous owners 62 Invicta convertible and his 62 Wildcat. The wildcat is an unrestored original which was the first Buick he ever purchased.
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The Invicta.
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Great story. Pays to be in the right place at the right time. Hopefully the changes you make will be small and minor. Very nice car. Enjoy.
Dan
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Very nice car you have, and nice stroke of luck. Steering wheel isn't even cracked. Must have been garaged it's entire life. Great pics for my original battery cable thread too :thumbsup:
DL
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Very nice! and thanks for all the pics! :thumbsup:
I really like the color combo. The light metallics highlight the body lines so well. And that interior.... my favorite color as well...the leather look is soo classy.
With such a nice original example, you can expect lots of questions from us on correct finishes and components. :icon_biggrin:
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Very nice car you have, and nice stroke of luck. Steering wheel isn't even cracked. Must have been garaged it's entire life. Great pics for my original battery cable thread too :thumbsup:
DL
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Thanks, but if you look close at the steering wheel, it is cracked. It's along the top of it. That and the white wall "out" look are the only things I plan on changing. I never liked the white wall look so I'm going to have the tires flipped for the dark side out. That, and I want to put a 15in wood Grant steering wheel on there and put the original in the closet. That's all I plan on doing to it except maybe an original style battery when the time comes.
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IM glad ya got the car..but i didnt read more than a sentence and just skipped to the pics..not trying to be negative..but have ya ever heard of an indented paragraph? us old guys dont have 30 year old eyes, and your paragraphs just run together and are hard hard to read....
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That's a great story Jonesy. :thumbsup: To have the cars complete history really is icing on the cake.
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Nice car and great find. Good you kept your eyes on it :thumbsup:
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Jonesy,
Glad to see you got the car looks good, did the orginal owner add the tach or did it come with it?
Heading to back to the bricks this weekend your dad going to be up there?
Regards,
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Thanks Jim,
The tach is a factory piece that was added by the previous owner. I think he said he added that sometime back in the early or mid 90's. If my dad goes it won't be for the cruise but will be that Saturday, the day of the show. If you go down to Saginaw St. at all during the week for the cruise and want to set up shop to watch, go to Mr. Front End on Saginaw. It's just to the North of Bristol Rd. on the east side of the street. If you hit Rockys' Cycle shop on the corner of Bristol and Saginaw, you went too far. Sure wish we were going to be there but we picked up this 65 instead. Next year for sure. We might be up at Christmas, not positive about that yet. How is your ride coming along?
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Yeah Saturday was my plan as well,
Cars haven't done much way too much heat and humidity up here almost makes me think the weather from the BCA show followed me home. just recently got nice and now we finally got rain which we needed.
Well I will keep an eye out for him, me and my stepdaughter will be there (she's driving my 4 door) as the wife has to work, start planning for next year as it will be here before you know it
later,