65GS.com - Buick Gran Sport Enthusiasts!
General Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: elagache on April 16, 2017, 05:39:40 PM
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Dear mid-60s Buick caregivers,
A friend of mine asked me about a strange warning that I got on the Summit Racing website with regards to buying parts for car registered in California. I hunted down the warning and here it is:
(http://www.canebas.org/misc/Capto_images/Summit%20racing%20warning%202017-04-16.png)
I got this warning when I purchased this Pypes exhaust system:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/pye-sga13r/overview/year/1965/make/buick/model/special (https://www.summitracing.com/parts/pye-sga13r/overview/year/1965/make/buick/model/special)
Okay those of us with 1965 or older cars aren't effected, but 1966 and after cars apparently cannot pick an exhaust system that doesn't meet the standards of the car's year of manufacture. Has anybody heard of this regulation? I assume it isn't retroactive, but it could be a problem if your 1966 needs a repairs and the new parts would violate this regulation.
Definitely curious and unexpected . . . . .
Edouard
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Dear mid-60s Buick caregivers,
On my previous post, I didn't take advantage of the "why am I being asked this?" link on the Summit Racing page. I decided that might be a good idea and it was. Eventually it took me to two pages from the California Air Resources Board (CARB.) The first one lists the general principles:
https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/aftermkt.htm (https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/aftermkt.htm)
The second gives more details:
https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/replace.htm (https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/replace.htm)
At the bottom of this second page is the exemptions by model year which are:
The following vehicles are considered uncontrolled vehicles:
- 1965 and Older : U.S. Manufactured California Certified Vehicles
- 1967 and Older: U.S. Manufactured Federally Certified Vehicles
- 1967 and Older: Foreign Manufactured Vehicles
I wasn't aware of this I wonder how many other California classic car owners aren't aware of this either. There is a database of approved parts that can be searched here:
https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/devices/amquery.php (https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/devices/amquery.php)
What I haven't found is when these regulations were instituted. I learned about this in 2013 when I bought the Pypes exhaust system for my trusty wagon, so it was true at least that far back.
This is all definitely a big surprise to me at least.
Oh well, . . . . Edouard
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I'm glad Michigan isn't the only state that passes laws that contradict its own previous law. A lot of this is federal based,but do not assume anyone actually reads or understands what they are legislating. The new salvage laws in Michigan state you cannot repair your own vehicle without paying a certified mechanic for their inspection,even if the repairs do not require certification under previous repair law. Just a quick glance at the California silliness would show that you CAN replace your 67 Buick engine with a newer Dodge Viper engine and be within the law. Makes a lot of sense that a V10 would put out less emissions than a turbo v-6...usually the same reason the term "politician" gets the rap it deserves. Don't be surprised how many "EO" part numbers show up from the same company.
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Dear Dan and puzzled automobile regulation observers, :icon_scratch:
I'm glad Michigan isn't the only state that passes laws that contradict its own previous law.
I spoke the manager of the classic car center at Orinda Motors and he was aware of these regulations. However, he has never had any of his customers have a problems. Still, apparently a cop could bust you if you violate these stricter modification regulations. Here is a web page the reports that:
http://www.btpautoparts.com/californialaws.html (http://www.btpautoparts.com/californialaws.html)
Just a quick glance at the California silliness would show that you CAN replace your 67 Buick engine with a newer Dodge Viper engine and be within the law. Makes a lot of sense that a V10 would put out less emissions than a turbo v-6...usually the same reason the term "politician" gets the rap it deserves.
Yes you can but no car after 1967 could have that sort of swap even if it would demonstrably decrease emissions from the factory configuration. As you say these sort of laws are ridiculous and are that way because politicians and regulators have very little understanding of the technology they are trying reign in and zero interest in actually understanding the situation.
Under the circumstances I'm going to follow Orinda Motors advice and keep a low profile. This is really a situation where a classic car advocacy group needs to lobby for laws to overrule these regulations and have the modification rules be the same as the smog rules. At the moment though, I would expect that the majority of cars that show up at say a Good-Guys show are in fact illegal in California. This isn't the sort of thing that you want regulators to suddenly decide to enforce their own rules.
Cheers, Edouard