65GS.com - Buick Gran Sport Enthusiasts!
Projects & Restorations => Projects & Restorations => Topic started by: cwmcobra on January 11, 2015, 10:33:46 PM
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After buying my 65 GS vert in 2009 and getting it running, that's as far as I got on restoration. I've been driving it a few times every summer and its performance always brings a smile to my face.
I turned 65 today, so think that's an omen that I'd better get my '65 GS restoration kicked into gear. I have a painter lined up. Time to begin disassembly.
Be prepared for lots of questions! :icon_scratch: I look forward to getting reengaged here. Good to be back!
Cheers!
Chuck
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I'm looking for a picture of a 65 GS vert in Verde Green with white top and interior. One of my possible color combinations. Anybody seen such a picture? I've Googled unsuccessfully. The closest I could find was this 64 Wildcat that looks REALLY nice. Must not be a very popular color for a GS????
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Or in Midnight Blue Poly?
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Mine is Verde Green with saddle interior and beige top.
It's still in 'as found' condition, awaiting restoration:
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That looks to be in pretty nice shape, Walt. Planning to keep this color scheme when its number is called for restoration?
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While considering color combos, what's the collective experience here with white convertible tops? Hard to keep clean? Black sounds easier, but I'm leaning toward white........
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Then and Now Restorations did a Verde Green/white 'vert. Just did a search and it's up for sale!
http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015 (http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015)
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Yes, I'll be restoring mine to it's original colors.
I like the saddle interiors. Light enough for a 'vert so it doesn't get too hot in the sun, and not so bright as white.... which will hurt my eyes on a sunny day!
Here's a pic of a saddle interior. Car was one of the dozens 'formerly owned by Mike':
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Then and Now Restorations did a Verde Green/white 'vert. Just did a search and it's up for sale!
[url]http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015[/url] ([url]http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015[/url])
Wow, that's a beauty! I like that color combo. Wish mine had A/C too.......
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Then and Now Restorations did a Verde Green/white 'vert. Just did a search and it's up for sale!
[url]http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015[/url] ([url]http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015[/url])
It is a nice car. Has a few things incorrect with it though.
Loren
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Then and Now Restorations did a Verde Green/white 'vert. Just did a search and it's up for sale!
[url]http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015[/url] ([url]http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015[/url])
It is a nice car. Has a few things incorrect with it though.
Loren
Mine already has a few things wrong that won't be changing during the restoration. It's not numbers matching to start with, but I like it in its current configuration. A nice driver is what I'm aiming for.
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Then and Now Restorations did a Verde Green/white 'vert. Just did a search and it's up for sale!
[url]http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015[/url] ([url]http://www.carsforsale.com/used-cars-for-sale/1965-buick-gransport-atlanta-ga-250807015[/url])
It is a nice car. Has a few things incorrect with it though.
Loren
Mine already has a few things wrong that won't be changing during the restoration. It's not numbers matching to start with, but I like it in its current configuration. A nice driver is what I'm aiming for.
Let me expand on that thought. The car was originally Arctic White with black top and interior; now is black with white interior (no top). It was originally an automatic; now is a Muncie 4-speed. It was originally a 4-barrel carb; now has dual quads. The engine was changed when the 4-speed went in. A previous owner simply swapped engine/tranny combinations to change to the 4-speed. He also added the tilt wheel and consolette. That's what I know about the car at present.
So I'm not trying to put it back to original or do a "better than from the factory" build like Mark Ascher's beauty is, for example. I will install power front disc brakes, fast ratio steering gear, updated suspension, 15 inch rally wheels with radial tires, larger exhaust and possibly some engine upgrades.
That's my vision. I hope I can achieve it in a reasonable amount of time!
Thanks for listening.....
Cheers!
Chuck
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Sounds like a good project. I definitely like the look of verde green. My 66gs vert is that color but she has black top and interior. It is a very uncommon color for 65-66. Never seen one with white interior. My dads 65 Gs hardtop is a dark Aqua teal car with white interior. Although he did change the interior color to black.
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/66NAILHEAD/3A00062A-0001-4502-83F9-33B428222960_zpszs31j4ep.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/66NAILHEAD/media/3A00062A-0001-4502-83F9-33B428222960_zpszs31j4ep.jpg.html)
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae270/66NAILHEAD/IMAG1226_zps8e584b73.jpg) (http://s978.photobucket.com/user/66NAILHEAD/media/IMAG1226_zps8e584b73.jpg.html)
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Verde green, black top. Can't recall whether this one had a black or saddle interior.
Mark
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Not exactly what your after, but this one is Midnight Aqua with white.
A great color combo in my opinion.
Mark
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Thanks for the pictures Mark. The Midnight Aqua is nice, but being a Michigan State Spartan, Verde Green is more like the color of my blood!
Believe it or not, that might play a role in my color decision.......
Chuck
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Disassembly has begun! Pretty easy stuff, but at least the project has been officially kicked off. I'll receive my Body manual next week and can dive into removing the interior using it as a resource. Long road ahead!
Cheers!
Chuck
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An unrelated question.....does anyone sell an aftermarket air conditioning system for the 65 GS? I suppose the dilemma would be the vents in the dashboard. Any way around that? Buy a different dash?
Thanks,
Chuck
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Chuck,
I think the plan you have for the car is great. A Gran Sport with those updates will always be desirable if done right.
Can't tell you much about AC, other than non AC cars have been changed to AC. The dash pieces can be had from
any 65 Skylark/GS/wagon, etc. with AC. or you could just do an underdash deal. One of the cleanest aftermarket
installs I've ever seen was on Roger Sears 65 GS. His car is awesome.
Check out Vintage Air and Classic Auto Air.
Mark
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Mark, good pics of Rodgers car.
Seeing how Rodger incorporated the vintage system makes for a really clean engine compartment. The interior is just as clean and shows no sign of an aftermarket system like the type that hangs under the dash.
If I remember correctly, he used a Sanyo compressor and a particular rear plate where the hoses attach. That allowed the compressor lines to turn down.
Definitely a sweet installation/
Loren
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Dear Chuck and mid-60s Buick fans,
An unrelated question.....does anyone sell an aftermarket air conditioning system for the 65 GS?
The honest answer is - no. You can't buy a plug and play system for a Buick. I was able to get a 1964-67 Pontiac GTO vintage air system to work in my trusty wagon, but you need to come up with your own compressor bracket, modify the controls to match the Buick A/C controller and "splice" the ducting into the original 1965 GS air vents. Also, you'll need a custom glove box liner that is much smaller than the original. The Vintage Air evaporator unit takes up a lot of the space that was formerly for the glove compartment. Also, you need to swap the condenser that comes with the GTO kit for one that will fit in front of your Buick radiator.
You can also get fancy about the routing of the refrigerant and heater hoses to keep the engine bay clean. I had the fellows who were installing the custom big-block Buick engine I had ordered for my wagon did all that "super-deluxe" stuff. The Vintage Air system seemed to work fine. Alas, the custom engine didn't. :angryfire: That's another story.
If you are really interested in going with an after-market A/C setup, send me a PM and I can share with you the "ups and downs."
Cheers, Edouard
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All
Good discosion on aftermarket Air Conditioning for 65 A body.
Fortunately for me 3 of my 65 GS have/had Factory Air.
Looking at my factory setup it seems like the heater box and controls would be a big undertaking to mix with aftermarket AC.
I have added a few more pictures of the Roger Sears aftermarket setup that I think he didn't try to mix with the factory.
It looks like he used vents in and under the dash and put the works behind the glove box with the controls at the bottom of the dash.
In the engine area he used a compressor with reversed hoses to go down and cut/smoothed some of the compressor mounting tabs.
To say Roger is a very gifted fabricator is a big understatement.
Unfortunately he isn't a computer person to explain how he did all this but it is a joy to see his car in person.
I don't think I have ever seen a cleaner modified engine compartment that I would rather have.
Milton
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Additional Roger Sears aftermarket AC installation Interior
Milton
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Last Roger Sears aftermarket AC installation.
Milton
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Dear Milton and mid-60s Buick fans,
Well, . . . . I have very little to be proud of with respect to my trusty wagon project. But the installation of the Vintage Air setup in my wagon is one of them. Here is what the driver's area looked like before:
(http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-pkfxCx4/0/L/IMG_1887-L.jpg) (http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-pkfxCx4/A)
Here is what it looked like after the installation of Vintage Air (and a whole bunch of other goodies:)
(http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-3V7tL6R/0/L/IMG_3208-L.jpg) (http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-3V7tL6R/A)
Here is the old Custom Autosound stereo from the mid 1990s:
(http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-xzCRJK2/0/L/IMG_1791-L.jpg) (http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-xzCRJK2/A)
Here is the new Custom Autosound 630 stereo and the twin round vents for the air conditioner:
(http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-CHttVQp/0/L/IMG_3206-L.jpg) (http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-CHttVQp/A)
Perhaps most important of all, here is the old glove compartment:
(http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-sgxLdrj/0/L/IMG_2174-L.jpg) (http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-sgxLdrj/A)
and here is the new one:
(http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-HxxXgJ7/0/L/IMG_3210-L.jpg) (http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-HxxXgJ7/A)
Smaller yes, but you can still use it!
Want a photo of the engine bay? Okay here's one:
(http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Biquettes-old-Edelbrock-air/i-VJkzLhG/0/L/Biquette%27s%20air%20cleaner-L.jpg) (http://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Biquettes-old-Edelbrock-air/i-VJkzLhG/A)
Nothing to be ashamed there . . . . if the rear crankshaft bearing hadn't failed . . . . :crybaby2:
Edouard
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Dear Milton and mid-60s Buick fans,
Well, . . . . I have very little to be proud of with respect to my trusty wagon project. But the installation of the Vintage Air setup in my wagon is one of them.
Edouard
Some really nice work there, Edouard! What does the custom compressor bracket look like?
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Last Roger Sears aftermarket AC installation.
Milton
Thanks for the pictures, Milton. Roger obviously does some nice work! I've got a couple of examples of potential A/C installations to consider.....
Chuck
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Chuck,
I think the plan you have for the car is great. A Gran Sport with those updates will always be desirable if done right.
Can't tell you much about AC, other than non AC cars have been changed to AC. The dash pieces can be had from
any 65 Skylark/GS/wagon, etc. with AC. or you could just do an underdash deal. One of the cleanest aftermarket
installs I've ever seen was on Roger Sears 65 GS. His car is awesome.
Check out Vintage Air and Classic Auto Air.
Mark
Thanks for your comments, Mark. Looks like I need to do more research on adapting A/C with or without a factory dash. Both Roger's and Eduardo's installs are really nice. Look for dash panels on ebay & CL? And here, of course!
Chuck
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Edouard
Your pictures demonstrate a purdy advanced skill set if you ask me.
Nice job!
Thanks for sharing with the rest of us.
A big part of this web site for me is to help advance the cause of our early GS and Buick A bodies.
Your posts and comments over time have definitely supported that line of thinking.
Thanks again for sharing.
Your Radio sure looks a lot better than your early one. Did you have to modify the dash panel? How about the Speakers?
The Glove Box looks very useful. Did you cut it down or are they available that way?
Milton
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Dear Milton and mid-60s Buick fans,
Well, . . . . I have very little to be proud of with respect to my trusty wagon project. But the installation of the Vintage Air setup in my wagon is one of them.
Edouard
I'll agree with Milton and Chuck, very nice indeed.
Loren
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Dear cwmcobra, Milton, and mid-60s Buick fans,
Thanks for your praise. Sure hope someday I actually can get the car to be operable once more.
Some really nice work there, Edouard! What does the custom compressor bracket look like?
I don't know anything about the compressor bracket besides the fact it is a welded "splice" between a standard Buick big-block compressor bracket and the the bracket that Vintage Air supplies with the GTO kit. Jim Weise custom built the bracket before shipping the engine he built for me. There is a guy on V-8 Buick who does make a bracket for the big-block. I don't know if he would consider coming up with a bracket for any other Buick engine, but you might get in touch with him. He goes by the handle longhorn I believe.
Your Radio sure looks a lot better than your early one. Did you have to modify the dash panel? How about the Speakers?
The radio is a Custom Autosound 630 that you can buy today. It will fit into the dash panel without any modification. However, it won't look as nice as it will with a few modifications. I documented the changes I made on this thread on V-8 Buick:
http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?268438-FYI-Custom-Autosound-mods-for-improved-authenticity (http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?268438-FYI-Custom-Autosound-mods-for-improved-authenticity)
The front speakers are once more the Custom Autosound kick-panel speakers that you can buy for the 1964-67 A-bodies. They have "fish-gill" vents for the cars that didn't come with factory air. You have the choice of two speaker models or you can just buy the panels and buy your own speakers. If you decide to upgrade a car that didn't have factory air to an after-market A/C system, I do recommend going with the fish-gill style of kick-panels because that will allow you to use your fresh air vents the car was originally equipped with. As far as I know, all the after-market A/C systems only provide recirculation so having the original air vents is the only way to bring some fresh air into the car besides opening the windows.
The Glove Box looks very useful. Did you cut it down or are they available that way?
The glove box liner is a completely custom. I made it from sheet metal after realizing that the original was 2 inches too deep. It is based on the original Buick cardboard design but is adjusted to squeeze into the limited space. I never have documented that modification, but I have the templates for making the box if anyone is interested and I have a lot of photos documenting how I did it.
Thanks again,
Cheers, Edouard
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Very nice work on these A/C installs! Having air certainly makes the cars more drivable for long trips or going down south.
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More progress with disassembly. Going on vacation for most of April and hoping to have it torn down and ready for the body work by the time I leave. Wish me luck!
How does one remove Dum Dum from painted surfaces? I guess it won't really hurt if the paint comes off with the Dum Dum, but when I put it back together, should I use Dum Dum again to seal around the tail lights? If so, are there any solvents that will smooth or clean Dum Dum without removing that pretty, new paint???
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The gunk around the tailights can probably be removed with Permatex spray on gasket remover.
Use a plastic putty knife and a rag, it should practically wipe off. Use a Metro tailight gasket set to reinstall the tailights.
Mark
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Thanks Mark! Great advice.
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As I'm proceeding with disassembly, I find that I am missing a few fasteners here and there and there will be quite a few parts that I'll want to replace with I reassemble. Has anyone that has gone through this before been "anal" enough to create a laundry list of where to find parts for our cars? I've already done a lot of searching and will do more, but if that process can be shortcut by sharing what's already been done by others, I say "why reinvent the wheel"?
I'm not being lazy, just hoping to shortcut the research time and to hopefully learn of suppliers that others have had good product and service from.
I'm recording details as I go and will be happy to share what I've done when my project is complete.
The snow has melted and the sun is out here in SW Michigan. I'm getting the itch to cruise!
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"Anal?" I don't know what your talking about.
I'll post later with more information on the subject....
Mark
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"Anal?" I don't know what your talking about.
I'll post later with more information on the subject....
Mark
Hey...he resembles....I mean resents that remark. LOL
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" I say "why reinvent the wheel"?
Might be a good idea to have a topic of that sort with postings of good results and where to find them.
Loren
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" I say "why reinvent the wheel"?
Might be a good idea to have a topic of that sort with postings of good results and where to find them.
Loren
Amen!!
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Loren,
You want me to start a topic that we can use a "sticky?"
Mark
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:headbang:
YES!
Loren
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Loren,
You want me to start a topic that we can use a "sticky?"
Mark
Great idea, Mark. I'm sure you have one of the most complete "lists" and the info would be much appreciated!
Thanks for offering!
Chuck
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Making progress on disassembly. Almost ready to pull the engine and tranny. In fact, would do it today if the weather was warmer....still in the 30s here :crybaby2:
Still need to remove the windshield. From what I read it has to be cut out with a special tool. Any tricks to doing this "easily"? Does it require two people to lift the glass out once it is liberated from the frame?
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Still need to remove the windshield. From what I read it has to be cut out with a special tool. Any tricks to doing this "easily"? Does it require two people to lift the glass out once it is liberated from the frame?
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I've always done it with a sharp utility knife. Working all the way around from the inside. Once it is started to get loose, start putting some pressure at the top on both sides by pushing out. Finish cutting it free while continuing to tilt it out.
It helps to have a second pair of hands.
Loren
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Thanks Loren! I'll have to scrounge up a second pair of hands....
Chuck
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Nice car, If mine looked that good I would be putting it together instead of taking it apart....lol. I am guilty of the same phobia,I guess I better get back to work on the body. Mine was a southern car originally,but it definitely saw some winters. I am going to post some pics hopefully when I get back to the shop. I used the alpha lower quarters on mine and still need to block it out and prime. Your car looks very straight in the pics. What is the original colors?
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Thanks! It was originally white exterior with black interior and top. It was redone about 15-20 years ago in it's current black exterior with white interior, but has no top. When redone this time, it will probably be Verde Green with white interior and top. Seeing that you are from Michigan, I bet you can guess which university alumni I am :icon_thumright:
Unfortunately, I bought the car with the front end in primer. If it had been still in the full black exterior, I would have driven it for a long while before thinking about a restoration.
Oh well, as my son-in-law says, it will make a great tailgate car at MSU football games! :occasion14:
Where are you in Michigan? I'm near Battle Creek.
Cheers!
Chuck
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We're on the east side north of Bay City. Your car definitely looked better than mine when I got it. The guy started to do a mechanical resto,but started the bodywork also. He didn't do me any favors on the body,but the driveline was pretty good. I tore it all apart and I slowly started fixing the shell back to original. I ended up cutting all of his fixes apart and putting in new trunk pans and lower quarters. The rest of the body is nice and just needs stripping and prep work. Looking at yours....you may be further ahead of the game than me. There is a lot of tedious work to be done on my shell. If it was not a four speed ragtop I may have did a "quickie" and just painted it. I am going back to the original white with white interior so I have been reading all the posts about the gray dash pieces. I thought my dash was just faded out when I got it,but the gray is correct(it is a very dark gray). Keep the progress posted,I need motivation,Dan
Don't get started on the whole Spartans/Wolverines....you can probably guess this side of the state is largely blue and maize....stepson graduated from MSU though. We don't hold it against him.
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Yeah, all my car is solid. Spent most of it's life in Washington state and then in Arizona. Surface rust on many parts, but nothing that will require metal replacement. So, no need to patch anything. Just prep and paint.
We grew up on the east side of the mitten and spent 11 years in Brighton. That was way too close to Ann Arbor and the rivalry got too serious. Still plenty of Wolverine fans over here, but they thankfully seem to be more civil about it.....
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Is it normal to have a piece of fiberglas insulation in the front quarters behind the ventilator housings? Mine has it on both sides. Trying to decide if I need to replace it when the time comes or just throw it out. Seems to me, since water can get in there, that I really don't want anything in there that will hold water and create rust.
What do you guys think?
Also, am I correct in assuming that a Shat-R-Proof windshield is not original? I've done some searching, but didn't find anything definitive.
Cheers! :cheers2:
Chuck
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Chuck,
I know of no instance where GM used fiberglass insulation, except the underhood pads.
GM windshields should be LOF = Libby Owens Ford. Tinted windshields, which were probably in most 65 GS,
would say "Soft Ray."
Mark
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Thanks Mark. Confirms what I expected on both counts.....
Chuck
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Another quick question. Any tips on how to safely and easily remove the power window electric harnesses from the doors? They seem pretty solid in their grommets. Any special tools recommended? Also the light switches in the door posts....I can't see how they come out without cutting the wires and I don't want to do that. Nothing else is cobbled on this car and I don't want to start now! :icon_scratch:
Thanks,
Chuck
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Chuck,
The switches in the door jamb just thread out. Put a socket on it and turn it counter clockwise.
The wire then just unplugs from the switch.
As for the power windows :dontknow:
Loren
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My 66 non AC GS had the same insulation in the same place, on both sides, and it is a fairly original unit.
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Chuck,
The switches in the door jamb just thread out. Put a socket on it and turn it counter clockwise.
The wire then just unplugs from the switch.
As for the power windows :dontknow:
Loren
Thanks Loren. I missed the wire unplugging from the switch.....
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My 66 non AC GS had the same insulation in the same place, on both sides, and it is a fairly original unit.
Interesting. Was your car built in Flint also? I wonder if it was an assembly plant-specific process? I still think I'll take it out. I'm not wanting it to hold moisture down there.....
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I need to l look and the vin. cannot remember. Will post back.
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Chuck,
I just replaced the power window harness to the drivers door in my convertible under restoration. It's next to impossible to pull the wires through the rubber boot. The entire harness including the boot in the door jamb needs to be removed from the door jamb side. Unplug the harness from inside the door and from under the dash. Those old boot grommets will be dry and hard making it difficult to push or pry them out. There is one under the dash that pushes outward to the door jamb, plus the larger grommet that you see from the door jamb. The grommet in the door also pushes out toward the jamb. It helped that I had the front fender off, but can be done with the door wide open only.
I could not get the rear quarter window to work. Tracked the problem down to the wire in the driver's door wiring harness. After I removed the harness, I unwrapped the cloth tape enough to slide the rubber boot back. The wire to the rear quarter window was completely broken, while all but two of the other wires were cracked with bare wire showing. 50 years of bending every time the door opened took its toll. I thought about taping them up but that would only be temporary. Bought a new harness from Lectric Limited for $155. It was a prefect match to the original with all the correct color coded wires and connections. Good luck.
John
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Thanks for the advice, John. I met with my painter yesterday, who has restored a ton of 60s vintage Pontiacs and a Riviera and he suggested putting some heat to the rubber grommets with a heat gun and then try to work the grommets loose around their perimeters. We'll see if that helps; I'm not looking forward to this task :sad1:
And thanks for the tip on the broken wires in the harness. All my power windows work, but I think I'd be smart to check out the harness to see if my wires are fatiguing as well......
Cheers!
Chuck
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Chuck, looked at the VIN, and it is a K, Kansas City build car.
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Chuck,
Even though my door harness boot was dry and hard, they did come out with a little persuasion from a screw driver. The grommet lip is not that wide. Once you get it started it will come out without drastic measures. BTW, I did go back and pulled out the passenger's wiring harness, but the wires there were good. Good luck.
John
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Chuck, looked at the VIN, and it is a K, Kansas City build car.
Interesting. I'm trying to decide what benefit the insulation would provide....why did they put it there??? Any ideas?
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Chuck,
Even though my door harness boot was dry and hard, they did come out with a little persuasion from a screw driver. The grommet lip is not that wide. Once you get it started it will come out without drastic measures. BTW, I did go back and pulled out the passenger's wiring harness, but the wires there were good. Good luck.
John
Good to know. Maybe (probably...) I'm getting excited about nothing!
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Next question......for those of you that have restored your 65's, did you do your own refurbishment of the Gran Sport emblems or did you buy new repops? I've not seen a good process for repainting them and some probably should be rechromed......
Thanks,
Chuck
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Chuck,
The Gran Sport emblems on my car were in reasonably good shape except for faded & chipped paint.
I attempted stripping and repainting them. Failed, although I got very close to success.
For the time I have in them, just get the repros!
Caution: the repro C-pillar emblem studs are too close together. You'll need to elongate the holes slightly with a Dremel or something like that.
Happy Easter!
Mark
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Happy Easter to you as well. It was a great day with family!
Thanks for the advice. My painter, who has restored quite a few cars, recommended repops as well. Just thought I'd see what the experience has been here. I'll look at your list to see where to purchase them from. And since my car is a convertible, I don't have to worry about the problem with the emblem on the C-pillars!
I think I've settled on my paint scheme now. I've looked at lots of greens and have decided that the one I like best is the 1965 Verde Green. With white top and interior. Probably a challenge to keep clean. And I know green is not a very popular color these days, but I'm not building this for resale. I expect it to stay in the family long after I'm gone!!
So, from what I've read here, white interior came from the factory with dark gray carpet and dash, correct? Both dashpad and dashboard are gray? Or should the dashboard be black?
Thanks again. We're leaving mid-week for vacation and will return at the end of the month. Then I'll have a couple of weeks to finish disassembly to have it ready to deliver to my painter. All that's left is to drop the gas tank, pull the engine/tranny, and pull out the wire harnesses. Then she's ready for some bling!
Cheers!
Chuck
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And thinking ahead to the reassembly stage, how much trouble is it to reinstall the power window mechanisms? My painter has had some bad experiences and thought I should have left them in the doors. Too late now......
Thanks,
Chuck
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Chuck,
Everything is a shade of gray - carpet, dash and dash pad. The power window mechanisms are not that difficult to reinstall its adjusting them that I found to be difficult. Lots of time and fiddling.
Dan
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Thanks Dan. Can I find the proper paint codes in a 1965 paint chip book?
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And that also means the steering mast and steering wheel are gray also? The same color as the dashboard?
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Wow, is it October already? I forgot how long ago it was that I updated my status on the 4-speed convertible restoration. I'm way behind my original schedule, but made some changes along the way that caused a detour or two. Add to it my purchase of Steve Shuman's red convertible earlier this year and some freshening work I did on it and I shouldn't be surprised that time is passing so quickly. :icon_scratch:
Earlier this year I made the decision to integrate a factory air conditioning system into this restoration. The car is not numbers matching and is already equipped with lots of gear that was not there from the factory. So I bought a 65 Skylark parts car with factory air and proceeded to prepare for installation into my car. Special thanks to Loren, Brian and Dan for talking me through the planning for A/C incorporation. I wouldn't have had enough confidence to proceed without their support.
Fast forward and the car is now ready to be put on the rotisserie and then delivered for media blasting. When it returns, my painter will begin the body work and I'll get started on stripping the frame to ready it for blasting and painting. We'll get it on the rotisserie after my return from vacation in mid-October.
That's my brief status update for now. I've attached a few pictures for your viewing pleasure, as I know that if there are no pictures, it didn't happen! :dontknow:
I'll check in again when I have more progress to report. Until then....... :cheers2:
Chuck
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Looks great Chuck! How did the conversion of the hole in the passenger kick panel area go?
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Thanks Brian. That conversion is partially done. I made a template from the parts car and cut the portion of the hole that comes out of the existing panel. We will wait to weld the "fill piece" into the kick panel until it comes back from blasting with nice clean metal :thumbsup:
As for the piece that has to be welded into the firewall in that area, I've cut the required hole in the firewall to receive it. While the body is away being blasted, I'll harvest that piece from the parts car, get it blasted and ready for installation into my car. Looks like it should be easy to locate by bolting the A/C air box outside the firewall into place, then attaching the harvested piece to it. That will determine where it gets welded.
The other holes were not that difficult. I took my time, checked and rechecked my templates and locations, then made rough cuts with a recip saw, followed by final, careful cuts with aviation snips. Thanks Loren for that tip! :headbang:
After cutting all the holes and drilling the required mounting holes, I test fit each of the pieces of the A/C system and they all fit well. I was glad to find in that process that the design of the system allows for some degree of misalignment. As we all know, manufacturing tolerances weren't all that tight back in '65. I think that worked to my advantage in my role as "shade tree mechanic"! :icon_thumright:
Thanks again for your advice and parts! I've still got a ways to go with correct lines, dryer and POA valve updates, but I'm happy to have this stressful stuff behind me.
Oh, and on the subject of parts, I was able to sell my '66 aluminum valve covers and purchase a nice set of the correct covers for '65. Onward and upward!
Chuck
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Great work Chuck! Another tip for the holes is once they are cut, you can use a flat file and a round rat-tail file to make the cuts look smooth and even. If you are patient and have the time, you can make them almost indistinguishable from the factory stamped holes using files.
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I did a lot of filing to deburr, but apparently don't have the patience to craft them into looking like from the factory :BangHead:
PS: Some of the edges of the factory stamped holes in my parts car are not that smooth........so I rationalized that I did OK :thumbsup: (Hmmmm, that blue "thumbs up" kind of looks like one of my fingers after hitting it with a BFH!)
PPS: I rolled the edges on all the firewall and kick panel holes that were rolled in the parts car. See how much patience I have?? :sunny:
They look good when the vents are installed!
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You are doing great Chuck. Had to be a nerve wracking time cutting those big holes in that perfectly good non-AC firewall. Enjoy your vacation.
Dan
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Looks great !factory opening were not that nice , covered by the air box anyways! And you will love a.c. too!
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Thanks Jon. Funny, my mother-in-law can't understand why I would want A/C in a convertible....... :BangHead:
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A question while discussing air conditioning. Does anyone repop the gaskets that seal the air box and blower assembly on both sides of the firewall?
And the fiberglas box containing the cold heat exchanger that mounts through the firewall and connects in the passenger side kick panel? Mine are usable, but new would be better.
Thanks,
Chuck
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I bought a set from Year One many years ago for my car. Made by a company called Re-Pops at that time. I think I had to buy them to fit a Chevy or Pontiac, but they were close enough that they worked.
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Very nice work Chuck!
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The Parts Place shows a 'Heater and AC Box Seal Kit', 14 pieces, for $24.00. Part #1017A.
Dan
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And that also means the steering mast and steering wheel are gray also? The same color as the dashboard?
Sorry to be so slow in responding. Totally missed your questions. Yes the steering column and wheel are gray. Column same as the dash, wheel a bit of a different shade of gray.
Dan
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Thanks Dan for all your info and advice! I haven't quite figured out my color scheme for the interior, except the seats and door panels will be bright white.
Lots of decisions to make! :icon_scratch:
Chuck
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Big day here.....off to the painter!
Got the body off and mounted on the rotisserie. Now will schedule it into the blaster, then return it to begin body work. And now I need to disassemble the chassis and prepare to get the frame sand blasted.
Progress!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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This will beat crawling around under the car!
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Lookin' good!
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Body just came back from the blaster and it was revealing. I have a few rust issues to deal with, but nothing terrible. I do need a new trunk brace on the driver side. Found a few online. Does anyone have experience with fit of these parts from OPGI, AMD, Ames, etc.? Looking for good fit to the trunk floor/body and good alignment of the caged nut for the body mount bolt.
https://www.opgi.com/skylark/1965/sheet-metal-body-panels/body-trunk-braces/PAN202/ (https://www.opgi.com/skylark/1965/sheet-metal-body-panels/body-trunk-braces/PAN202/)
http://www.autometaldirect.com/amd-64-67-chevelle-gto-skylark-cutlass-trunk-floor-brace---lh-p-5029.html (http://www.autometaldirect.com/amd-64-67-chevelle-gto-skylark-cutlass-trunk-floor-brace---lh-p-5029.html)
https://secure.amesperf.com/qilan/Detail_Web?part_num=K155L&order_number_e=MzkxNzEwOQ%3D%3D%0A&web_access=Y (https://secure.amesperf.com/qilan/Detail_Web?part_num=K155L&order_number_e=MzkxNzEwOQ%3D%3D%0A&web_access=Y)
Thanks,
Chuck
PS: The trailer needs help too, doesn't it??? :laughing7:
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Chuck,
That shell looks pretty good to me. There are a lot of 50K cars out there that would look a lot worse than that if they were stripped. If that is still bare steel you better get some metal conditioner on it.
Mine was very similar in the rust areas. I just ordered the supports when I replaced the trunk area. You may be further ahead to think small on rust repair. A good welder can make small repairs and you want to avoid cutting on those quarters. Most of those body supports are made overseas. I think Dynacorn sells the correct ones for us through their site or maybe someone knows of a distributor for u.s. stampings. They are usually a bit more,but made to the correct specs as far as fit and thickness.Dan
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Thanks Dan. I've taken your advice and ordered a part from Dynacorn. Interestingly, it was less expensive than virtually all of the other brands I found. Can't confirm that it's made in the USA, but expect it will fit well and be of proper gauge.
Thanks for the recommendation!
Chuck
PS: It will be in primer by the end of the week.....
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No worries about surface rust on that blasted body anymore. It's now in etching urethane primer and ready for metal repairs, etc.
I've also finally harvested the stamping from the parts car that will be welded into the restoration for mounting of the A/C airbox through the firewall. And I made a sheet metal patch for the passenger kickpanel for the fitment of the A/C box through the kick panel. Those will be welded tomorrow and the body will begin the full fledged patching process to repair rust holes. Nothing terrible, but quite a bit of work.
A replacement trunk brace will arrive on Tuesday and installation will complete the welding required.
Progress; gotta love it!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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To close the loop on the A/C conversion, we welded the two plates in place today. All the pieces were fit to locate the plates and the car now looks like it was originally an A/C car....almost :laughing7:
Tomorrow my trunk brace arrives and we'll be installing it on Wednesday. Meanwhile, my friend Dick is working on patching rust holes in the body while I work on disassembling the frame.
Special thanks again to Loren, Brian and Dan for talking me through the A/C project!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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The replacement trunk brace arrived and was installed. It was a nice piece. Proper metal thickness, accurate stamped configuration and high quality caged nut for the body mount bolt. As always, it required some tweaking, but nothing major. Thanks for the tip on Dynacorn, Dan!
Purchased from DynacornDepot.com in California. The part was drop shipped from Pittsburgh.
Chuck
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Frame is all stripped down and hopefully will be going for sandblast late this week. I'm shopping for steering and suspension components to install when it comes back. Any preferences from you guys? I've spec'ed out all the MOOG parts I need and consider them to be a top shelf brand. Anything else I'm missing? I have a bill of material I can share if anyone is interested in what I've found so far. RockAuto seems to have the lowest prices it seems.......
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Used Moog on my 66, seems like good stuff and I believe US made. Not sure where I got it but maybe Espo?
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I bought all the MOOG parts from a local auto parts store that was NOT a chain. Some of you MN guys might know these places, but a hard parts store, like Welle Auto Supply or Motor Parts is where I shop.
And then there is a member here who bought all of his chassis parts on Amazon. Go figure.
Mark
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Chuck , it looks like ur making a lot of progress .
It,s looking really good so far , keep on posting pictures when you can it helps me stay motivated .
Funny Mark should mention Welle auto supply , I worked there for 12 years right out of tech school .
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Looks like you're moving along quite well Chuck. Here in Michigan,some carquest stores are still independently owned. My local carquest guy gives me better prices and parts than any of the big three chain stores here. I have bought a lot of "hard to find" pieces through them. Moog is probably the best out there for stock replacement suspension parts. I have bought heater core,water pump,carb rebuild kit,front end,shocks,etc....all over the counter and usually in a day or two. Dan
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Thanks for the encouragement! I'll post a picture or two tomorrow.
Chuck
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A couple of pictures of the "liberated" frame.
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Meanwhile, back in the body shop........
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Frame is back from sandblast. It will get a coat of etching urethane primer tomorrow. Control arms and crossmember are in for blasting now. Rear axle will also go in for blasting soon.
Guess I'd better start ordering those steering and suspension parts!
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Chuck... I know you are not ready yet, but, I parted out a 65 4 door WITH A/C years ago and I still have some of those a/c parts, ie; brackets, vents, cables, etc... When you get to that point, lemme know what you need. :occasion14:
Wheelz, Tampa Bay
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Thanks Wheelz! I think about all I need now are the main A/C lines and fan shroud.
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You sure are moving right along. Nice looking frame BTW. Keep the pictures and progress reports coming.
Dan
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Great progress Chuck! I'm amazed how fast some of you guys get stuff done, that doesn't happen around my place.
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Thanks guys! I normally wouldn't move this fast, but my restoration painter is moving me right along! :headbang:
Lots of parts and work ahead, but just like the rest of you, I'm looking forward to it!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Does anyone have a good approach to properly locating the shifter hump on a 4-speed conversion? My car was an automatic originally and it was converted to a Muncie 4-speed, but a shifter hump was not installed. And it looks like there was part of a hole that had a fill piece welded in. Does the automatic have a hole in the tunnel or is it actuated electrically? At any rate, I tried to fit the shifter hump today and it's nearly fitting on the tunnel. If someone has a template and/or locating dimensions I'd be grateful to receive them. Otherwise, I guess we'll have to wait until the body is on the frame and the engine/tranny are installed to locate the location for the shifter. And that's not doing it right, is it???
Here's a few pictures from disassembly below.
Thanks,
Chuck
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Chuck,
The factory style listed below only fits the floor one way. It is contoured to go where it is supposed to. My original was fubarred and this one looked like a good copy of it.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1964-67-CHEVELLE-4-SPEED-FLOOR-SHIFT-HUMP-64-65-66-67-/351588484997?hash=item51dc4e8785:g:qB8AAOSwQJ5URQw7&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/1964-67-CHEVELLE-4-SPEED-FLOOR-SHIFT-HUMP-64-65-66-67-/351588484997?hash=item51dc4e8785:g:qB8AAOSwQJ5URQw7&vxp=mtr)
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Thanks Dan. I'm sure I have the correct hump, just want to be sure I install it correctly. I am also sure that if I open up the hole in the tunnel the hump will fit better. The end that fits to the skinny side of the tunnel fits great. The other end has the rolled edge sitting proud on metal that is still left on the tunnel. So if I carefully remove metal in those areas where the rolled hump edge interferes with the tunnel, it should fit better.
I'm comfortable with this approach; just wanted to see if I was missing a better, more precise way to locate the hump. I'd hate to locate it now only to find out it's not right when I install the engine/tranny. :BangHead:
Chuck
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Chuck,
Have some pictures of the hump location on my convertible and Mark's hardtop. Will post them tomorrow.
Does sound like you are on the right track though.
Dan
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Perfect, thanks Dan!
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Dear Chuck, Wheelz, and mid-60s Buick caregivers, . . .
Frame is back from sandblast. It will get a coat of etching urethane primer tomorrow. Control arms and crossmember are in for blasting now. Rear axle will also go in for blasting soon.
Glad your "patient" is looking so much better! Keep up the good work!
Cheers, Edouard
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Wow Chuck , Your making great progress . The car is looking good . Look forward to seeing it in person someday .
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Mark Ascher's manual floor shift.
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Here's the underside of my '66. They weren't very precise in cutting the hole in the floor.
The hump was 'modified' to fit a Hurst shifter. The Hurst sits further back than the original, keep that in mind if you are considering an upgrade.
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Thanks Walt and Dan. Looks like precision is not needed. Since I know the shifter fit into the existing hole, I can locate it fore/aft by that and cut around the rest to fit.
Once again, a picture (or two) is worth a thousand words!!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Primed and ready for GM Chassis Black paint. I'll wait until I have the control arms, crossmember, core support, sway bars, etc. blasted, primed and ready for paint also.
Still shopping for parts! :icon_biggrin:
Chuck
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Dear Chuck and mid-60s Buick "checking that list twice" types, . . .
Still shopping for parts! :icon_biggrin:
By all means keep shopping! No wallet was ever hurt by shopping . . . . . that only happens when you actually buy something! :laughing7:
If you buy it on a credit card, the pain doesn't come for another month or so! (http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/D'oh.gif)
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Dear Chuck and mid-60s Buick "checking that list twice" types, . . .
Still shopping for parts! :icon_biggrin:
By all means keep shopping! No wallet was ever hurt by shopping . . . . . that only happens when you actually buy something! :laughing7:
If you buy it on a credit card, the pain doesn't come for another month or so! ([url]http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/D'oh.gif[/url])
Edouard,
My wife manages the finances so it's only painful for her, and I love her for it! :icon_thumright: :love4:
Chuck
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Brian provided me with this info:
Picture with dimensions reference is attached. Front to rear arrow is 6.5?, and side to side arrow is 7/16?. More detailed description:
From the seam at the front of the tunnel to the front edge of the shifter hole, it's 6 1/2 inches. On the side-side measurement, here is what I did: from the seam inside the rocker jamb, where the rocker is spot welded to the floor pan there is a hard edge there. From the left (driver) side seam to the top edge of the shift hole opening is 28 1/8 inches. On the right (pass) side, the measurement is 29 inches even. From the center of the car, the distance to the edge of the shifter hole is 7/16?
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Thanks for the dimensions. That will be a good double check for my installation!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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I've hit a snag in my shopping :help:
Any leads on where to find a new center steering link and new front A-Arm bushings (actually, rods and bushings). I can get them special ordered from ESPO, but they are really expensive. Any other sources you guys have found?
I think my rods are OK, but ESPO says no one sells just the bushings without the rods.......
Thanks,
Chuck
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The upper A-arm shaft and bushing set is made by Rare Parts
http://rareparts.com/ (http://rareparts.com/)
They are on the expensive side. They are sold through other vendors, you might be able to apply a discount coupon or something. NAPA and Autozone carried them some years ago.
The centerlink is once again available from the various resto suppliers or on eBay. Most likely made overseas but that's the only choice unless you find a NOS one somewhere.
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Chuck,
Check Rare Parts in California for the bushings & shafts. No idea what the price is on them there, but they were not cheap years ago.
The alternative is to use upper arms for a non-Buick with press in bushings. What was the cost at ESPO?
Not sure what tell you on the center link... google + phone are your friends. May be the same part as Chev/Pontiac/Olds so keep
other sources in mind.
Mark
PS: Walt, you beat me to it!
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$145.53 direct from RareParts.
Do a Google search for 'Control Arm Shaft Kit RP15605' for other vendors.
Year One lists them for $116, Autozone (with 20% off coupon) is $114.
The originals can often be reused if they are not worn.
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Chuck, once the upper ball joint is dis-connected wiggle the a-arm to see how much play may be in there. Can see that it HAS been greased so it may be OK. At what they cost no need to replace parts that are NOT nec.
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Thanks guys. I've got the shafts and bushings, along with a center link in my cart at Autozone, but haven't pulled the trigger yet. Tom, I appreciate your comments. The suspension is all apart now, but when I was disassembling, the A-arms felt very solid and tight. The bushings and rods have now been disassembled, can I inspect for wear? Where do they wear, inside the end caps? If I could replace the bushings/seals only I probably would, but haven't found anyone that sells those separately. Is it advisable to reuse the old rubber seals and metal end caps?
If I clean up and reuse the shafts that I have, how should they be finished? Painted chassis color or clear or?
Chuck
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Any experiences to share with rubber vs. polyurethane suspension and body mount bushings? It seems that's all that Energy sells and I've heard from a number of people that the polyurethane improves tightness, body roll and other handling characteristics. The knocks on them are that they are noisy (creaky, squeaky) and deliver a harsher ride by telegraphing roughness of the road. My car will be a driver and while I enjoy a tight handling car, I'd hate for it to become annoyingly noisy on road trips. That said, I'm leaning toward the rubber bushings for both suspension and body. Are all rubber bushings essentially the same or are their preferred brands?
Anyone with much better experience with polyurethane than I'm hearing?
Thanks,
Chuck
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Chuck ,
I,ve driven older cars with polyurethane bushings and it did seem to make them handle better but I really didn,t care for the feel of the car , just too much road feedback for me .
But thats just my opinion , some people maybe like that feel .
We even put a set of aluminum bushings in a camaro once , with poly bushings in the control arms OMG :icon_puke_r:
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Thanks John. That's exactly the feedback I've gotten from other sources, including ESPO. Don't think I'd like that. Oh well, rubber is old school, right? I'll have to dig up a thread I remember about where to source body mount bushings.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Chuck,
I reused the factory upper bushing rubber dust boots and the small clamps that hold them on. Can't recall if the Rare Parts bushings
had the rubber boots and clamps, if they did, they didn't look right - in any case I ended up using the originals.
The shafts were never painted to the best of my knowledge, I just shot a coat of clear on them to keep them from rusting up.
I have 0 experience with plastic/polyurethane/etc bushings. If your not building a dedicated drag race, slalom, road race type deal,
use the rubber parts. Will you drive it enough to wear it all out again?
Mark
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Thanks Mark. I'll get the shafts blasted, clear them and clean up the dust boots. They're not torn and the crimped clamps were reasonably tight. You guys just saved be about $300!
I read last week that studies now indicate the common drug Metformin, that's used to lower blood sugar for those that have diabetes, can have powerful anti-aging characteristics. Scientists now think it is reasonable that life expectancy can be stretched to about 120 years. So, don't count me out on wearing out those bushings. Now to get my doctor to confirm those results and write me a script......or not. :laughing7:
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Problem is, depending on how strong the MG's are, can damage your liver. The cure is sometimes worse than the deisese.
Back to cars. I have removed poly from LOTS of customers cars because of the harshness of ride. I myself don't like them for all suspension parts. I DO use them for the sway bar bushings & end links. I also use them for the top of the front shocks. On some I have used them on the lower control arms ONLY as there is more weight for jounce & rebound to help offset the harshness of the ride on the front.
On my Riv. I also use them for the strut rod & rear panhard rod bushings. Makes for a better handling car & there is little to no movement of the components while riding down the road.
Just remember to tighten all suspension bolts when the components are at ride height or else the rubber gets torn up rather quickly.
Just my opinions.
Tom T.
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Thanks for the great tips, Tom. So in my case, you're saying that the suspension bolts shouldn't be tightened until the body is back on the frame, correct? If so, thanks, I wouldn't have thought of that.
Chuck
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Thanks for the great tips, Tom. So in my case, you're saying that the suspension bolts shouldn't be tightened until the body is back on the frame, correct? If so, thanks, I wouldn't have thought of that.
Chuck
I've always understood it is best to tighten the suspension after everything is together, including drive train installed, so full weight of car is on the suspension.
My approach is to have the front on ramps and the rear end on jack stands. Then torque bolts to spec.
Loren
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I waited until the car was finished and had gas in the tank before snugging down the front and rear control arm bolts.
I did this just as Loren described.
Mark
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As a side note to the discussion on tightening the bolts in the suspension bushings, if you use the polyurethane suspension bushings, you don't have to wait until they are loaded to tighten them down. Polyurethane bushings are designed to rotate inside of the metal sleeve (they have really sticky synthetic grease on them). So you can tighten them down at any position in the suspension travel.
I have the poly bushings in my 64 and in my 65 GS. Big difference in handling and the difference in the ride harshness is not noticeable to me with radial tires on the car. If you have bias tires, it will ride rougher. Another benefit of the poly bushings on a driver car is it cuts out a lot of the wheel hop with a posi rear end if you happen to get the rear tires turning faster than the car is moving!
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Thanks for your comments Brian. Now I'm torn. Do your poly bushings creak and squeak? That's something I noticed in the past with a production car with poly bushings. It creaked every time I turned right.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
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I don't hear any creaks in mine and it has the newer bushings that have the synthetic grease in them. Of course, I have only put 2000 miles on my car since I finished restoring it 10 years ago! Plus I have 40 series flow master mufflers and 2.5" pipes on the car, so that is the predominant sound! I have heard cars with the older bushings creak as you are describing, but I don't hear that in my 65.
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Thanks Brian. I assume your poly bushings were from Energy?
And did you use poly body bushings also?
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At the risk of blaspheming, has anyone installed a cruise control on a 65 GS? I expect this to be a road car and would appreciate that convenience. Are there factory setups from other cars or other years that might work? I'd like to avoid an aftermarket approach if possible.
First air conditioning, now cruise control. What will I think of next? I know.....a GPS Nav screen! No thanks....
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Cruise control - not in a 65 GS but I have Dakota Digital cruise control in our 57 Dodge pickup. We have driven it through about 20 or more states when doing the Power Tour and it works great! The way you sit in the small truck cab would cause my ankle to hurt or stiffen up after just a few hours of driving. The cruise control was a godsend.
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Dear Chuck, Jim, and mid-60s fans of modern conveniences, . . .
At the risk of blaspheming, has anyone installed a cruise control on a 65 GS?
. . . .
Cruise control - not in a 65 GS but I have Dakota Digital cruise control in our 57 Dodge pickup. We have driven it through about 20 or more states when doing the Power Tour and it works great! The way you sit in the small truck cab would cause my ankle to hurt or stiffen up after just a few hours of driving. The cruise control was a godsend.
I just hunted down the link from Dakota Digital and . . . . Wow!
http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=46/prd46.htm (http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=46/prd46.htm)
Looks like a really neat product and since they supply a stalk mounted controller, it could be added to almost any car without too much pain. Alas, their controller just won't work in my wagon . . . .
(https://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-nH2swKL/0/XL/IMG_3209-XL.jpg) (https://canebas.smugmug.com/Biquette/Drive-Train-makeover/Dashboard-before-and-after/i-nH2swKL/A)
Don't these silly guys know that I need a stalk-mounted cruise controller in - CHROME!!!! . . . . :laughing7:
First air conditioning, now cruise control. What will I think of next? I know.....a GPS Nav screen! No thanks....
Okay no GPS screen, but you could consider something close that could be still discreetly hidden. At least the Apple iPhone can speak to you the driving directions. I'm sure that isn't as convenient as a display, but it should get you there if you are listening carefully. If you get lost you can pull off the road and then consult your phone to see where you went wrong. I'm not up on android phones but there may be something similar by now.
I think it is about as close as you can easily get to having that cake and eating it too. Another idea that I've been pondering is to incorporate a phone stand into a console that on a bench seat would be in between the front passengers. When you aren't using the phone, the stand could be folded into the console to avoid the high-tech intrusion. On a car with bucket seats, you might have more options to hide a smart-phone support while keeping the original console.
Food for thought, . . . .
Edouard
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Edouard,
No chrome, but how about polished aluminum?
http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=55/category_id=-1/mode=prod/prd55.htm (http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=55/category_id=-1/mode=prod/prd55.htm)
Chuck
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Poly vs rubber bushings....
The upper front A-arms already have STEEL bushings, so they won't deflect much!
If you add a larger diameter front swaybar with poly bushings, it should keep things under control if you use rubber lower A-arm bushings and still maintain a nice ride. Most of the weight is carried by the lower arms anyway.
I like Tom's suggestion of using poly bushings on the shocks... that should allow the shock to perform its job better.
Are you putting a swaybar on in the rear? It will require boxed lower control arms. Once again, that will keep the rear from moving around too much.
Hot Rod magazine did an article on modifying a '66 GS for strip use, 'Blueprinting Buicks for Action', April '66 issue.
To stiffen the rear bushings, they drove 1/16" to 1/8" 'nails' into them!
http://wildaboutcarsonline.com/cgi-bin/pub9990262549620.cgi?categoryid=9980384637237&action=viewad&itemid=9990398172817 (http://wildaboutcarsonline.com/cgi-bin/pub9990262549620.cgi?categoryid=9980384637237&action=viewad&itemid=9990398172817)
I'd also suggest the 'control arm reinforcements'. There are some posts on the subject here:
http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?73629-CONTROL-ARM-BRACES-Don-t-leave-home-without-em (http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?73629-CONTROL-ARM-BRACES-Don-t-leave-home-without-em)
You have a choice of aftermarket ones, or ones similar to the original GTO 4 speed ones.
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Thanks Walt. Interesting and helping to hone my approach. The person that did the previous restoration of my car did a couple of things to the suspension. First, he put a very large diameter sway bar in the front, over 1 1/4" diameter. I think he said it was from a Firebird, but I'm not sure about that. Second, the car does have a rear sway bar that is bolted into boxed rear control arms. Since I have some of the improvements for my suspension, I think I'll take the advice from you and Tom. Poly on the front sway bar and shock tops and rubber on everything else. Sounds like a "best of both worlds" approach that I'm willing to give a try!
Now, does anyone have a comment on poly body bushings?
Have great weekend!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Now, does anyone have a comment on poly body bushings?
My suggestion is to use the factory version - rubber. Walt did a review of all the various manufacturers a while back and it is posted on here someplace. Just have to do a search.
Dan
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http://65gs.com/board/index.php?topic=862.msg6526#msg6526 (http://65gs.com/board/index.php?topic=862.msg6526#msg6526) Reply #52
I researched the heck out of this a few years ago for my '66 GS....
I've bought body mount kits from Year One ( hardware store-grade bolts were disappointing), CARS (same as everybody else but they cost more) and Ground Up. All the bushings looked the same, but the Ground-up kit at least had the correct flanged bolts included for $80 :thumbsup::
http://www.ss396.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=chevellecamino&Product_Code=DCC-1515 (http://www.ss396.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=chevellecamino&Product_Code=DCC-1515)
If you want the best match to originals, I'd recommend the following:
1) The kit from Ground-Up, pn DCC-1515
2) There are 2 mounts over the rear axle that don't use bolts. (Puck bushings) You can get repos from the CARS spin-off site here: I believe Ames sells these too.
http://www.oldcarstuff.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=1450 (http://www.oldcarstuff.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=1450)
pn BM-11
Mounts behind the rear wheel are a larger diameter, about 2.5". The oldcarstuff BM4 and BM644 are close, but may be a little thicker.
Another source for individual bushings is www.restorationspecialties.com (http://www.restorationspecialties.com) I bought a few bushings from them to use for the rad support. A very close match, but I had to enlarge the ID.
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^^^^^^ That looks familiar!
Bill followed up on some of that info and we discussed it on V8:
http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?290996-My-66-GS-hardtop-body-mounts (http://www.v8buick.com/showthread.php?290996-My-66-GS-hardtop-body-mounts)
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Walt, not everyone is a V8Buick member so ....
Picture #1 of Lower washers, bolts, and rubbers, washers are the same except the 2 rear one' they are slightly smaller. Rubber mounts all seem to be the same, front 4 bolts and 2 rear are the same length, the center under the door, are shorter, not sure about the 2 in the rear wheel well, had to cut off heads to remove.
Picture #2 of drivers side front, the inner mount is larger.
Picture#4 of rear wheel well, the mount is larger
This car appears to have never been apart.
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Picture#10 of rear mount, the steel insert appears slightly different.
Pictures #8 and 9 of rubber mounts only, no bolt, 2 each side under rear seat area and over rear spring pocket, these are the same but smaller in dia and height than 6/72 ones.
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Dear Chuck and mid-60s road-trip cruisers . . .
No chrome, but how about polished aluminum?
Ooooh! Serves me right to have not check a bit further. All of a sudden that is starting to look like a very interesting addition to my trusty wagon!
Thanks for spotting that accessory! :thumbsup:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Does anyone have pictures of how the fuel return line on cars with A/C is routed along the frame? My parts car had this line replaced and I'm quite sure it's not in the right space. The clips in the frame appear to only be used for the main fuel line and the brake line. Where does the return line go?? :dontknow:
Thanks!
Chuck
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Chuck,
The return line is attached to the fuel supply line using a special clip. I'll take a look at one of the chassis I have around and see if that still has the lines on it.
Loren
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Couple of pictures of the lines and of the clips that hold the return line to the brake line.
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Thanks Loren. So I conclude that I need a set of the brake/fuel line clips that pop into the frame and a set of the "S-hook" clips that hook the return line to the brake line. I see they are available from Inline Tube (and probably others). Looks like Inline Tube sells them in sets of 10 each.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Correct Chuck!
Loren
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Time for an update. I'm getting ready to paint my frame and control arms and have all the parts to put the suspension back together. Today, I expect my painter and I will be putting GM Chassis Black on the underside of the body. And the interior will get its coat of red primer. Then he'll be ready to put sealer on the body, then base coat. That will make it look entirely different than the yellow high build primer look it has now!
The engine came apart pretty well, except I broke a thermostat housing bolt in the coolant crossover manifold. The only visual problems I see are a mark in one of the cylinder bores that scares me a bit; almost looks like a crack, but no coolant leakage. And the timing chain has about an inch of slop in it. A picture of the mark is below.
One other thing that surprised me....the valvetrain in the two heads look different as night and day. On the driver's side, it's all clean looking, almost new, with very little visible wear on valve tips. On the passenger side, everything is discolored and appears as if it has scale and/or sludge on it. And the valve tips are obviously more heavily worn. I'm wondering if the heat riser valve in the exhaust on that side stuck closed and caused exhaust gas backpressure that heated the entire head more than usual. My heat riser was broken when I got it and I just wired it with the butterfly in the open position. Of course, the PCV is on that bank as well, but I don't understand why that would cause higher heat within the valve cover. Pictures below.
Ordering parts from Carmen this week and will get the block and heads to the local machine shop soon. Sure hope that mark doesn't turn into a disaster...... :BangHead:
Chuck
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They get cruddy like that normally from an improperly operating crankcase ventilation system. Usually mainly on the right side with the "Nails".
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The first part of the body is finished. Got the underside painted in GM Chassis Black today. Woohoo!! :occasion14:
Before and after pictures below. Tomorrow we will paint the interior in Red Primer. Stay tuned!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Great progress Chuck!
Did your car originally have undercoating on it? That seems to have varied according to where it was built.
My Fremont, Ca cars had it in only in and behind the rear wheelwells, and my Baltimore cars had it on the floor pans as well.
I had a hard time matching the red interior primer. The PPG epoxy was too red. Rustoleum was actually a better match.... and cost MUCH less.
For 'factory correct' be sure to put LOTS of body-color overspray onto the interior, and some on the underside.
Great to see your progress. :thumbsup:
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Thanks Walt. This car was built in Flint and I don't think it had undercoating.
My painter has done quite a few GM restorations and has the red primer for the interior. I don't know what it is, but will check it out tomorrow. And we are in agreement on overspray. He's already asked me about that and agrees with your recommendation! :icon_thumright:
I also have gray lacquer on the way for the dash and urethane for the steering wheel.
Wait till you see the body color.....one near and dear to your heart: Verde Green. The interior will be white though, unlike your Saddle interior. We're actually not too far away from base coat.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Sounds like you found a great restorer for the paint work. I've learned a lot from the 'other' boards such as http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/ (http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/)
Couple of guys there have actually worked on the assembly lines back in the day.
It's a great resource, much of it can be applied to our Buicks.
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Cool! Thanks for the tip, Walt!
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Chuck , Can,t wait to see the body painted verde green . Do you have an approximate time before it will be painted ?
I need to take a road trip out your way to pick up some parts for my 65 and would love to stop by and meet you and of course check out the car . :icon_biggrin:
Looking great , keep up the good work .
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John,
You are welcome any time. Except the last week of the month when we will be on vacation. I suspect that my painter might be planning to paint the body with sealer and then base coat Verde Green while I'm away. Keep me posted on your plans and let's get together if we can!
Chuck
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Interior is in Red Primer. Pictures below.
The primer used is Autobody Master Hi Prime Lacquer Surfacer. Hi Prime - Red Oxide #8402. More info: http://www.autoparts2020.com/rsdev/part_group.jsp?PHPRJ_GROUP_ID=48595 (http://www.autoparts2020.com/rsdev/part_group.jsp?PHPRJ_GROUP_ID=48595)
The color looks pretty right to me. It seems to look darker in the picture than it is. The second picture of the close-up of the dash is closer to it's actual color.
Chuck
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Looking good Chuck! :icon_thumright:
Thanks for keeping us posted with your progress! (http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/thanks_sign.gif)
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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More progress. Two of the surfaces are in final color! The firewall is in black lacquer and the dash and associated bits are in Charcoal Gray lacquer. And the trunk is in gray primer awaiting it's Zolatone application when the body color is finished. I've selected Zolatone # DX1756. This is the OEM color for GM cars from 1961-1966 according to this website http://www.tcpglobal.com/ZOL-DX1756-QT.html#.VqLQly7SnVg (http://www.tcpglobal.com/ZOL-DX1756-QT.html#.VqLQly7SnVg). Color is called "Warm gray with white and black (spatter)". I looked at Medusa Gray, but didn't like it. Too much brown in the base color and also some brown spatters.
I'll be on vacation next week, so no updates for a while. My painter's plan is to have the base coat and clear applications done by the time I return. And he'll be busy wet sanding! :icon_thumright:
I'll be checking in from vacation, so you might hear from me before we return.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Looks really good Chuck!
Loren
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The gray on the dash is really nice. Just the right amount of gloss. Rest of the car looks good to.
Have a great vacation. Thanks for the pictures.
Dan
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Dan, thanks for the paint codes and for hooking me up with Kris at Tower Paint. It amazes me how expensive automotive paints are, but I'm very pleased to have the right colors!
I've found the correct SEM vinyl dye at our local auto body paint shop for the dash pad. And please reconfirm, are the kick panels the color of the dash or the dash pad?
Thanks again!
Chuck
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Yes, looks great!
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Looks really good!! Nice job. Your painter does awesome work.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Thanks Dan. Yes he does nice work. At 77 years of age, he's had lots of experience! :headbang:
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That's awesome!!! I hope I'm still painting at that age.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Dear Chuck, Loren, Dan, Jim, Dan, and mid-60s Buick restoration enthusiasts . . .
More progress. Two of the surfaces are in final color!
Looking good! :thumbsup:
I'll be on vacation next week, so no updates for a while.
Enjoy the break - you deserve it! :glasses9:
My painter's plan is to have the base coat and clear applications done by the time I return. And he'll be busy wet sanding! :icon_thumright:
(http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/wink_smile_triangle.gif) . . . Awe shucks, you're going to leave your painter working hard while you're on vacation? Oh wait, he'll be "wet sanding" . . . . is that some kind of "wet pleasure"?!? . . . . :laughing7:
I'll be checking in from vacation, so you might hear from me before we return.
(http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/wink_smile_triangle.gif) . . . . Oh I'm not sure about that, . . . if my humor gets any worse!! . . . (http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/garrh_!.gif)
Seriously have a great vacation! :icon_thumright:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
P.S. (http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/wink_smile_triangle.gif) . . . .Ya' know, I never realized now much class car restoration turns out to be a wonderful spectator sport! You get to see a rusting hulk turn into a thing of beauty and you don't even have to get your hands dirty! Maybe Loren and 65GS.com should sell tickets! . . . . (http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/big_grin_triangle.gif)
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Thanks Edouard. Part of me wants to stay home and keep working on the 65, but I never pass up a family vacation. If I'm still awake after the late nights at WDW, I'll check in from time to time. I promise! :thumbsup:
Chuck
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"Maybe Loren and 65GS.com should sell tickets! . . . . "
Now there is an idea.
Loren
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Final pictures before I travel. The dash "unmasked". Drain ports installed in the floor and trunk.
That's all folks! More pictures after I return. John, just for you, expect to see Verde Green! :icon_thumright:
Hope you all survive the snowstorm. For once it missed us here in Michigan.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Chuck , your car is really coming along and looking GREAT .
I,m envious !
I want to be working on mine but this house addition and pole barns we are putting up is taking forever .
I,m really hoping to take a road trip in Feb. to MI. to pick up some parts i,m buying out there and would love to swing by and take a peek at your Verde green 65 .
I,ll keep in touch .
Keep up the good work . LOOKS GREAT :icon_thumright:
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Chuck , your car is really coming along and looking GREAT .
I,m envious !
I want to be working on mine but this house addition and pole barns we are putting up is taking forever .
I,m really hoping to take a road trip in Feb. to MI. to pick up some parts i,m buying out there and would love to swing by and take a peek at your Verde green 65 .
I,ll keep in touch .
Keep up the good work . LOOKS GREAT :icon_thumright:
What he said X2, less the addition and barns.
Loren
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Maybe you guys can hook up and visit together. Double the fun! :occasion14:
I'll be in touch when I return.
Chuck
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I've found the correct SEM vinyl dye at our local auto body paint shop for the dash pad. And please reconfirm, are the kick panels the color of the dash or the dash pad?
Chuck
Sorry to take so long. Kick panels are the color of the dash. NOT the pad.
Dan
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I've found the correct SEM vinyl dye at our local auto body paint shop for the dash pad. And please reconfirm, are the kick panels the color of the dash or the dash pad?
Chuck
Sorry to take so long. Kick panels are the color of the dash. NOT the pad.
Dan
Thanks Dan! Waiting in line for Big Thunder Mountain [emoji2]
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
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Back in sunny Michigan....until tomorrow when I will once again be soggy. :crybaby2:
Took advantage of the nice day to get my rear axle blasted and primed. I also visited my car at the painter's and, as expected, it is now in color. It's in the process of wet sanding the clear, so the pictures below look more gray than green. Except the shot from the rear, where you can see more of the Verde Green. When it is rubbed out, I'll show you what Verde Green really looks like!
Ordered fuel tank, sending unit, etc. and hope to start assembly of the chassis soon after painting parts and frame in GM Chassis Black this week.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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That's gonna be one GORGEOUS vehicle!!!!!!!!!
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Looks sooooooo good!!! Did you guys use ppg dbc base/clear? I am curious what was the ppg number is for verde green. My 66 convert is verde green
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Thanks guys. The paint used was Nason base/clear. I'm told that Dupont sold their auto paint business to Axalta, who rebranded it as Nason. We'd use PPG, but don't have a local source.
Chuck
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Yep they did. It's hard getting used to calling it Axalta. I've used DuPont /Nason for many years. It's very good paint. In fact I'm using nason on a willies jeep restoration I'm doin at home. At the collision shop I'm at we use ppg.
Can't wait to see your car buffed out.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Chuck , Soooooo cool !!!
Can,t wait to see it . Looking awesome :icon_thumright:
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This is really going to be a nice car! Thanks for the updates!
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Chuck,
I see the large holes in the door jambs on your car--did it come with PW on it or did you add those while it is all apart?
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Glad everything is coming along Chuck!
Thanks for keeping us posted!
Cheers, Edouard
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Looookkkiiinngg goooood!
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Chuck,
I see the large holes in the door jambs on your car--did it come with PW on it or did you add those while it is all apart?
It came with power windows.
Chuck
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What's the proper way to refinish the front upper A-Arm bushings? The threaded cups that hold grease. Are they painted or plated? If plated, what type?
Thanks,
Chuck
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Hey John - my Verde Green is showing!
Rubbing out has begun. I like it!!! :occasion14:
Chuck
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Lovin it!! Looks really nice Chuck
Loren
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Thanks Loren. We have a long way to go!
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That looks great, I love the green!
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CHUCK CHUCK CHUCK !!!!!!
I,m drooling looking at it . :tongue3:
I just put it on my screen saver . Man it,s looking great !
I,m planning a road trip in march your way .
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Thanks guys. As I said to Loren, we have a long way to go, but it's really exciting to see the car starting to take shape.
John, keep me posted on your travel plans. The body will be done by then and I hope to have the chassis done also.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Dear Chuck, Loren, Jim, John, and mid-60s Buick owners who are "green" with envy . . . .
Hey John - my Verde Green is showing!
(http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/wink.gif) . . . Awe shucks, ain't it a bit early to be starting to see the green things of Spring? After all it is still the first week of February! . . . :laughing7:
Seriously, definitely looking good! While I have thing this for "Seafoam Green," :love4: Verde Green also looks very good on a classy Buick! :icon_thumright:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Frame, control arms, sway bars, etc. are now painted GM Chassis Black. Got a bunch of fasteners to get plated, then I can start reassembly. Woohoo!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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How/why did you separate the front crossmember from the bottom of the radiator support? I have taken two damaged ones before and made one good one by separating the parts, but it was a lot of spot weld drilling involved to do it!
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Good question Brian. I've never done one of these before and as I disassembled that part of the chassis, it came apart. I thought it was supposed to be that way! Ignorance is bliss, I guess.......
I guess I can't really answer your question!
Chuck
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You're moving faster than me Chuck and I like that color! I just got my tail lights back from the plating shop and now I have to get motivated again.
You guys have done this body and paint in no time and it looks great.
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Thanks Dan. That speed is from my restorer that's doing the body and paint work. And since I'm paying him by the hour, I wish he'd speed it up! :overthetop:
I've still got lots of plating to do, so I doubt that I'm much ahead of you......
Chuck
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Exterior of body is complete. Just waiting for the Zolatone paint for the trunk (when the weather warms) and application of white paint on the A-pillars and select spots in the interior and it will be finished. I need to assemble the chassis and then we will start on the fenders, doors, hood and trunk lid.
Couldn't get the Zolatone color I wanted so will have to settle for the Silver Gray. TCPGlobal offered the OEM color on their website, but after I ordered it, they came back to say that they can no longer get one of the toners required, so it's not available. :crybaby2:
Still lots to do, but I'm very pleased so far! :icon_thumright:
:occasion14:
Chuck
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Wow! I should get going on my project.
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Chuck, it's looks incredible!!!
I have to get going on mine too. Also Verde green, but with saddle interior and beige top.
Lately I've been wondering if I can retire early and just work on my cars full time instead!!
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Thanks guys!
Walt, I retired early and it took me 7 years to get started on this project. So, I encourage you to retire, but don't wait so long!! :headbang:
Chuck
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Chuck, I've been following your project and that Verde Mist color is really growing on me :icon_biggrin: Of course being a convertible just makes it much more interesting and attractive to me. Starting to really like the 66 cars, but since there's already a few 66 hoarders around, I'd never catch up. :thumbsup:
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Thanks Tom. I obviously love this color.
Well, if the 65s and 66s are being hoarded, have you considered a 64? :laughing7:
Chuck
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Thanks Tom. I obviously love this color.
Well, if the 65s and 66s are being hoarded, have you considered a 64? :laughing7:
Chuck
Already had a 64 Skylark convertible and a 64 basket case parts car. Since Buick did not offer big blocks in 64, the short answer is no. :icon_biggrin: :hello:
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Well, I don't blame you. I'm a fan of big blocks too! :hello2:
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Mister T, there are no rules stating you COULDNT PUT A BB NAILHEAD IN A 64...RIGHT?
Just Say'n.
You could be the start of a new trend!!! :headbang:
Wheelz, Tampa Bay
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We made the trip to Michigan, AKA, Pure Michigan, The Great North or The Winter Wonderland and located Chuck's remote outpost were we conducted some project recon.
The pictures of Chuck's frame and suspension components understate the quality of workmanship and finished product. It looks like it just came off the assembly line, I was taken back by the smoothness of the surface, original factory production stamping's are clearly visible and distinct. I don't think I could put a car on it and cover it up; it should be mounted on the wall as a piece of art.
I highly recommend the trip if you have the opportunity, if you're lucky he may even pull the covers back on some of the other masterpieces in his den.
Thanks again Chuck for your warm welcome and your assistance with my parts needs.
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Kevin,
Thanks for the glowing report. You must not have looked close enough to see the "factory runs" on the frame! :laughing7:
Great to meet you and Angie and swap some car stories. Looking forward to another meeting soon.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Mister T, there are no rules stating you COULDNT PUT A BB NAILHEAD IN A 64...RIGHT?
Just Say'n.
You could be the start of a new trend!!! :headbang:
Wheelz, Tampa Bay
Already been done Dennis. :icon_biggrin: Saw this 64 at the Gopher State show in spring 2014.
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Here's a side view of the same car. It was a very nicely done install, which Buick should have done at the factory. :thumbsup:
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Time for an update. The body is finished. Now going to work on assembling the chassis and completing the engine rebuild. Fasteners have been plated. Block, heads, crank and pistons are at the engine machine shop. Machining should be complete by the time I receive the new parts from Carmen. Giving my painter some time off to work on his '68 GTO project. Will get the body out of his shop soon so that he can start work on the fenders, doors, hood, trunk, etc.
Happy to achieve this milestone! :occasion14:
Chuck
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More pictures. Medusa Gray Zolatone in the trunk. Dark Charcoal lacquer on the dash. White lacquer on the A-pillars and other spots where they might show with the white interior. Black lacquer on the firewall. GM Chassis Black on the underside. Red oxide primer on the interior. What a broad color palette!
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👍👍
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What a beauty. Compliments to you and your painter.
Dan
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Thanks guys. And Dan, I can only take credit for selecting the painter. He's done all the artisan work :icon_thumright:
And thanks for all the great pictures of your car that we used to determine what to paint where. That was a lifesaver!
Chuck
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Chuck ,
I can,t hardly wait to see it , it,s really looking great .
Just to let you know your build is keeping me very motivated . I,m ordering parts almost everyday .
see ya soon .
:hello: :thumbsup:
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Chuck, looks outstanding. Some fantastic work seen here lately.
Mark
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Looking awesome!! The fun part of assembly is next. Enjoy the journey. Hope to see it in person some day. John
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Yeah, the fun part of the assembly is next. No matter how much you bag/tag parts removed the questions always seem to appear, " I don't remember removing this, where the hell did this come from???" It's ALL good!!!!! Now you can learn to become a detective also.
Tom T.
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Dear Chuck and 1965 Buick GS caregivers,
Thanks for sharing all these details with us! Indeed the patient is really starting to come back together beautifully! This is the phase that makes up for all the hard work cleaning and preparing. So savor the joy of bringing this car back to life!
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Chuck, have been watching your progress from the background. Rollaround gave me a full report after his visit. Great job. I have always had a soft spot for that color, as my first 65gs was also green with a saddle interior, 4 speed post car. Can't wait to see it in person.
Glenn
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I started putting it back together today. Woohoo!!!! Did my take on recreating the markings on the axle yesterday, then began assembly today. Man, does it feel good to begin this phase of the project. Will begin on the front suspension and steering later this week. And my block, assembled heads and crank should be coming home from the machine shop this week also. The block was in good shape, bored to +0.030, the crank was perfect; just polished, the heads were in good shape except one exhaust valve seat that was pitted and replaced with an insert. Valve guides were good. All in all, I'm quite pleased.
More to come later this week.
:occasion14:
Chuck
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Dear Chuck and mid-60s Buick caregivers,
I started putting it back together today. Woohoo!!!!
Glad to see you are on this phase of the project! Keep up the good work! :icon_thumright:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Nice DETAILING there Chuck! WATCH OUT CONCOURSE GUYS!!!! :headbang:
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I'm in the process of having my radiator converted from a non-A/C configuration to one correct for my restoration that will have A/C added. I've been having trouble finding the elbow on the radiator inlet for the A/C configuration. I've found a potential source, but need basic dimensions of the elbow. So, if someone can reply with that information I'd be very grateful. Dimensions would be diameter, rough angle of the elbow (90 I assume) and the length of each leg on the triangle of the elbow.
Thanks in advance.....you guys rock!
Chuck
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Guess it's time for an update. I've been really bogged down with other things for the past few months, so progress has been slow. The chassis is almost finished. The engine is almost built. The body is almost ready to meet the chassis. Seems like I'm almost making progress......but I am.
Decided to be more factory correct and buy the T10 4-speed from John Egel to replace the Muncie M21 that my car came with. Bought a Hurst shifter for it and back up light switch and bracket. Also the Muncie shift lever adapter for the Hurst shifter. So when that all arrives, I hope to have finished engine assembly and be ready to install the engine and transmission into the chassis. Then the Gardner exhaust system that's been sitting in boxes here for weeks.
The finished body has been moved from the paint shop to my shop and now rests on sawhorses right next to the chassis. When the chassis is ready, I'll have to fit the body bushings and then mate the two. Meanwhile, the sheetmetal parts (hood, deck lid, front inner and outer fenders, core support, doors) will go for media blast and paint work will resume. Carmen is working on my carburetors and they'll be ready soon.
There's my status. Summer seems to be flying by, but maybe I should wish for fall when all the yard work, pool maintenance, etc. is done for another season and I'll have time to focus on the GS!
I will be enjoying driving the red convertible to the local "Cruise to the Fountain" on Saturday night. And get my repaired starter installed in the Cobra for when I need a real rush of acceleration....
I'll get pictures up when the chassis is done.
Cheers!
Chuck
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You're making good progress Chuck!
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Dear Chuck, Jim, and mid-60s Buick caregivers,
Guess it's time for an update. I've been really bogged down with other things for the past few months, so progress has been slow. The chassis is almost finished. The engine is almost built. The body is almost ready to meet the chassis. Seems like I'm almost making progress......but I am.
Hang in there! Everybody is short of time.
There's my status. Summer seems to be flying by, but maybe I should wish for fall when all the yard work, pool maintenance, etc. is done for another season and I'll have time to focus on the GS!
Ain't that the truth. According to the calendar, summer is barely two weeks old but I'm already worn out from the heat!
I'll get pictures up when the chassis is done.
Looking forward to them!
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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It's been a long time coming, but I've reached a milestone in my restoration.....the chassis is essentially complete. All new steering and suspension components, including a 1 1/4" front sway bar from a Firebird that came on the car. It also came with boxed rear control arms and rear sway bar. And I've added rear stiffeners (thanks Brian Stone!). New Right Stuff fuel and brake lines. Front disk brakes were installed (I'll be running 15" rally wheels). Steering gear has been rebuilt by Hector from V8Buick.com with quick ratio gearing.
The engine is rebuilt and waiting for my refreshed carbs and linkage from Carmen to top it off. The missing torsion clutch return spring has been procured (thanks Bob Bowen!), cleaned up and installed in the bellhousing. The rebuilt T-10 (thanks John Egel!) has been painted, "KR" marked and installed, replacing the Muncie M21 that was removed. Hurst shifter with back up light switch has been installed. Driveshaft is installed along with the Gardner exhaust system. I also installed the A/C compressor (thanks Brian Stone!) and will now work on restoration of the alternator and power steering pump. I haven't put roller wheels on it yet, but will soon when ready to roll it under the body that's been waiting for it. I successfully modified the two mid-frame body mount bushings to fit into the smaller frame holes, so the chassis is truly ready to accept the body. I have some work to do on making seals for the Z-bar linkage pieces that I'd like to put on before mounting the body. Need to do it this week as the weather forecast is looking good after several days of rain and ideal for rolling the chassis outdoors to locate it under the body.
Meanwhile, the sheet metal is all in high build primer and will be painted Verde Green in the coming weeks. Lot's of work left, but it feels good to see it coming together!
Cheers!
Chuck
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More pictures.....
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Extremely nice Chuck !! Congratulations on your latest milestone.
Dan
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Wow Chuck
Looking really great!
Hard to imagine it was only a couple of weeks ago since I seen your car as part of the Northwest Ohio 65GS get together.
Congratulations
Milton
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Chuck , very nice . Excellent detail .
Looks like your at the funnest part of the build . ( except for turning the key )
I wouldn't be able to stay out of the shop that point !
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Looking great!!! [emoji1303][emoji1303]
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Hi Chuck,
Sweet! Yep, this is the fun stage of a restoration. Looking good!
John
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Dear Chuck, Dan, Milton, John, Dan, John, and mid-60s Buick fans of really sweet rides, . . .
Looks like your at the funnest part of the build . ( except for turning the key )
I definitely agree! As wonderful as it is to put the car back together you are really going to enjoy starting up that engine and cruising down Main Street!
Congratulations! Restoring a car is always a wonderful feeling but making it as special as you have is really going to make it your pride and joy!
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Very nice work Chuck!
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Extremely nice Chuck !! Congratulations on your latest milestone.
Dan
X2!!!
Almost ready to install that interior. lol
Really looks sweet Chuck. You're setting a high bar to reach.
Loren
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Thanks guys. I'm pleased with reaching this point and apprehensive about what lies ahead. But I'm ready! Don't worry Loren, you'll be hearing from me when the interior is in my sights!
Cheers!
Chuck
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Should be metal-metal contact between exhaust manifolds & heads. NO GASKETS. & I don't see ANY french locks for the exhaust.
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Sorry, my mistake. I DO see the french locks now that i blew up the pictures.
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Hi Tom,
Yeah, as you found, the French locks are there. I haven't bent the tabs yet, leaving the option of taking out the gaskets. What's the downside of using them? Do they take a set and leak?
Thanks,
Chuck
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Doesn't transfer heat from the heads/manifolds properly & can cause cracks. Best is to bring the manifolds to a machine shop to have them surfaced FLAT. Make sure they are cut STRAIGHT & not on an angle. Takes time to set-up properly & can be kinda costly. DON'T use a BELT sander as this will round the sealing surfaces. IT NEEDS TO BE FLAT. My machinist uses his head cutting table to do this on his head re-surfacing machine.
Tom T.
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Thanks Tom.
Chuck
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Wow you are moving along Chuck! At this rate you will have her ready for the national's in Brookfield! I got two that need to be done ,I'll bring them right over lol!
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Thanks John. The Nationals is my goal, but since this is the first time I've done this, I know there is LOTS more to do between now and then. We'll see.....
Chuck
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Milestone complete. The body is back on the chassis. Starting to look like a car again…..
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Chuck,
That looks great. Now the fun starts. Every piece you put on the car is one step closer to driving it.
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Chuck,
Every piece you put on the car is one step closer to driving it.
Amen! Thanks Glenn!
Chuck
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Looks like you are going a great job!
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Milestone complete. The body is back on the chassis. Starting to look like a car again…..
Doing great work. Milestones like this give a real sense of accomplishment. Enjoy the achievement.
Dan
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All right Chuck!! Another step closer.
Loren
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Dear Chuck and mid-60s Buick caregivers,
Milestone complete. The body is back on the chassis. Starting to look like a car again…..
Yes indeed it is coming back together! You are really doing a great job!
Cheers, Edouard
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Very nice Chuck , can,t wait to see all done in person someday .
Your doing a really nice job .
-
Chuck,
Excellent work, keep the pics coming. BCA Nats is July 5-8, no pressure or anything.
:occasion14:
Mark
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Very nice Chuck; perfection in motion. This is an over the hump moment were you can start looking at whats been accomplished as opposed to what lies ahead.
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Thanks all for the kind comments. I do appreciate the work that is done and look forward to what's ahead. July will be here in no time!
Right Mark, no pressure!
Cheers!
Chuck
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Very nice car Chuck,
I like that color combo,Dan
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Well, I'm back from a month-long vacation with a very long list of tasks to make this restoration complete. All the paint and body work is complete; just need to put it together. But I don't think I'll be making the Nationals this year. Like John E., I just don't want to rush it and make mistakes along the way. But progress will be made and reported. I think my focus will soon turn toward getting the red convertible prepared for the Nationals for judging in the unrestored category.
Kevin suggested a new judging category for in-process restorations. There are a few of us here that could fit nicely in that category!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Chuck , Hows your Chrome investment coming along ? :laughing7:
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Not sure. I haven't received the parts yet. Partly because I don't think they are done and because I've been delayed getting home by the hospitalization of my mother-in-law in Ohio. Hoping to return home by the end of next week. :crybaby2:
Chuck
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Chuck , Sorry to hear about your mother in law , pray all goes well with her .
I,m sure your chrome will be there when your ready . I know the chrome shop i,m using got really busy all of a sudden .
Take care
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Dear John, Chuck, and caregivers of so much more than mid-60s Buicks,
Not sure. I haven't received the parts yet. Partly because I don't think they are done and because I've been delayed getting home by the hospitalization of my mother-in-law in Ohio. Hoping to return home by the end of next week. :crybaby2:
Sorry to hear that. I feel your pain brother. I hope it all turns out well and that you can return to just worrying about your Buicks!
Cheers, Edouard
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Thanks guys. She's home from the hospital, recovering from pneumonia. Just need to get her back to the point that she can be alone during the days. Probably next week.
Not my favorite way to extend a vacation, but glad she is on the mend.
Chuck
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Not my favorite way to extend a vacation, but glad she is on the mend.
Chuck
Glad she's getting better.
Dan
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Same here.
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I think it's time to kick start this project. I'm actually working on it again. Loren has dubbed it "The Verde Howitzer"....I like it!
Just starting back into it and have a question already. Are there any sources for the gasket that seals the fuse block to the firewall? Or do I need to make one? If so, any suggestions on material?
It feels good to get going on this again!
Happy Total Eclipse Day!
Chuck
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Chuck , great to see your back at it .
I won't get back on mine for a couple months yet . But post pictures when you can to keep me motivated .
looking forward to your progress .
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I think it's time to kick start this project. I'm actually working on it again. Loren has dubbed it "The Verde Howitzer"....I like it!
Just starting back into it and have a question already. Are there any sources for the gasket that seals the fuse block to the firewall? Or do I need to make one? If so, any suggestions on material?
It feels good to get going on this again!
Happy Total Eclipse Day!
Chuck
Got one made this afternoon and will get it in the mail tomorrow.
The material it is made from appears to be the same foam we used when I worked in aviation upholstery.
Loren
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Thanks Loren, you don't waste any time!
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
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Progress has been slow due to "other stuff" going on. But I did manage to get the firewall and floor pans covered with noise and heat reducing materials. I chose to use products from RAAMAudio.com including RAAMat and Ensolite PS in this package: http://www.raamaudio.com/package-1-20-sheets-of-raammat-bxt-ii-37-5-sq-ft-and-3-yards-ofensolite-iuo-peel-and-stick-41-625-sq-ft/ (http://www.raamaudio.com/package-1-20-sheets-of-raammat-bxt-ii-37-5-sq-ft-and-3-yards-ofensolite-iuo-peel-and-stick-41-625-sq-ft/).
First I installed the RAAMat (silver color). It's kind of like Dynamat, but thinner, more pliable and I think easier to apply. That is mostly intended to deaden noise from the engine compartment and the road. I know, it probably won't make much difference in a convertible with the inherent wind noise, but I'm more hoping to reduce heat in the passenger compartment. And that's where the Ensolite is recommended because it is a better thermal barrier than RAAMat. Ensolite (black color) is applied over top of the RAAMat. Both have adhesive backing for "press and stick" installation. And both together are said to be superior to Dynamat in both noise and heat reduction and are cheaper to boot.
Pictures attached. Now I feel like I can start putting the interior together, as time allows.
Chuck
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Dear Chuck and mid-60s Buick owners with way too busy lives, . . . .
Progress has been slow due to "other stuff" going on.
I hear ya' brother . . . . . . :BangHead:
But I did manage to get the firewall and floor pans covered with noise and heat reducing materials. I chose to use products from RAAMAudio.com including RAAMat and Ensolite PS in this package
Hmm, very interesting! :idea1: I have Dynamat on the firewall of my trusty wagon, but no where else. Dynamat is a bit thick and hard to apply. This could be very useful!
Thanks for sharing! :thumbsup: I've bookmarked this outfit for future reference!
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Wow, over a year since I've posted an update. Last year was not a good one for progress. Feels good to get back at it!
Finished up the dash today. Makes the interior look alot farther along. Had the radio "tuned up", so hoping it will be in better working order.
Made some progress on the engine bay and A/C system also. Hopefully, I'll be installing the core support, radiator, etc. soon.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Really looks great. I had forgot you were running dual quads too!
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Thanks Jim. Those carbs are placeholders until I receive the correct ones from Carmen. Hopefully soon!
Chuck
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Looks nice Chuck . I'm so far off schedule I don't even remember when we were going to debut our cars together . We,ll have to come up with a plan at Robs party this year . Keep up the fine work .
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Dear Chuck, Jim, John, and mid-60s Buick restorers
Great to see that you back on task and putting the car together! :icon_thumright:
What did you have to do to the radio to get it working again?
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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It is wonderful you have found time to get back in the grove and of course it looks great; I’m so jealous.
The soundproofing/thermo-shield is interesting. Is the exposed black finish surface smooth plastic or a textured fabric?
Glenn and I are planing a road trip to your place, probably early next month just to get our Buick project fix and maybe do lunch.
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I don't know how anybody that does that nice of work ever gets anything done.
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Thanks Guys!
John - It's a date. Let's put our heads together at the meet.
Edouard - The radio was repaired and tuner aligned by an old school radio tech in Ohio. He was recommended by my restoration mentor and it turns out he's located only 20 minutes from our family, so we are in his neighborhood frequently.
Kevin - The black material is cellular and definitely not shiny. You guys are always welcome. Just check first to make sure I'm not visiting your state at the time... :laughing7:
Dan - Guilty....it's only been five years since I started this project and it definitely feels like I don't get much done! Let's see how long it takes for my next post :headbang:
Cheers!
Chuck
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Received my restored carburetors from Carmen today. And had to install them right away. They look like jewelry to me.....Sure perks up the engine bay!
Chuck
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Carb identification.....
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Also working on adding paint to the grille, headlight doors, rear emblem and taillights. Here's the completed grille.
Chuck
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WOW Chuck , Those are beautiful looking carbs . Grill looks great too .
MAN I GOTTA GET MOTIVATED ! I think after the AACA meet in Auburn I,ll get back on the car .
Nice work , keep it up .
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WOW Chuck
Considering it jewelry is an understatement!
Very nice indeed.
Milton
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That looks outstanding! That?s what I need to do with my grille.
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Dear Chuck, John, Milton, and mid-60s Buick caregivers,
WOW! those carburetors really do dress up the engine! :hello2:
Also working on adding paint to the grille, headlight doors, rear emblem and taillights. Here's the completed grille.
The grill looks great! Did you have the grill chrome restored?
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Also working on adding paint to the grille, headlight doors, rear emblem and taillights. Here's the completed grille.
The grill looks great! Did you have the grill chrome restored?
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
[/quote]
Thanks!
That is a NOS grill for a Skylark, so just had to paint the black on the interior sections and silver on the apron that tucks under the bumper.
Chuck
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Real 4-speed carb set, NICE!
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Well, it appears I've stumbled into a road block with my engine. Fired it up a couple of weeks ago and broke it in for 20-30 minutes then shut it down for the day. Fired it up the next morning and found the oil pressure dropping as the engine warmed up. It had peaked at between 40-50 psi the day before, but couldn't get above 20-25 on this day. When I dropped it to idle and the pressure was 10 psi or below, I shut it down. Something strange is going on as the oil pressure gage needle sort of vibrates within about a 10 psi range. It doesn't read a stable pressure. Pulled the distributor and found that it had not been properly seated during some part of its operation. Had it repaired and recurved by Carmen and carefully installed it, certain that it was properly seated in the block so it would engage the oil pump drive shaft. Still low oil pressure. So now it looks like I have to drop the oilpan and replace the oil pump. Not sure yet if I can do that without pulling the engine. :BangHead:
I'll post the results when I get it put back together.
Chuck
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Chuck are all the plugs in the block? There are the internal ones in the rear by the cam shaft I believe !
Maybe Walt or Tom will chime in! Buddy of mine had some what of the same problem!? Hope you get it figured out! Sure wouldn’t want to trash a fresh rebuilt motor! Best of luck! Would give Carmen a call to!
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Hey Chuck... start with the simple/easy stuff first. I different gage directly piped into the block? Most OEM engine design/builders require a pound of pressure for every 100 RPM. More is better of course, but to a point where 100psi is TOO much. Run some 20w50 in there. Getting oil on the valve stuff?? Bill
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Thats NOT good news Chuck . Thats always my biggest fear when rebuilding an engine that I'm not familiar with the first time .
I'm sure you'll get it figured out though . The hardest part on these nailheads is the cam bearings and the oil pumps .
The way you describe the oil presure gauge needle fluttering sounds like a bad gauge or sending unit .
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Dear Chuck, Jon, Bill, John, and mid-60s Buick caregivers,
Well, it appears I've stumbled into a road block with my engine.
. . . . .
I'll post the results when I get it put back together.
So sorry to hear about your setback. Indeed I hope you'll get some helpful advice on the forum. Hang in there! Engine problems do get resolved! Although sometimes it takes . . . . . (http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/patience_emoticon.jpg)
Cheers, Edouard
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I have the same pressure readings from two different gages, so don't think that's the problem. I'm going to pull the distributor and drive the oil pump with a drill motor and see what pressure I get. That should tell me whether it's the pump or not. I have a new one ready to install if that's the case.
What about oil viscosity? After draining the breakin oil I installed 10W30 racing oil. I also have 20W50; would that help? Are nailheads sensitive to viscosity?
More to come.....
:cheers2:
Chuck
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....I'm going to pull the distributor and drive the oil pump with a drill motor and see what pressure I get.....
That's where I would start.
I haven't seen those symptoms before. Wonder if it could be a problem with the pressure relief valve in the filter adapter oil pump, the oil pump pickup is being sucked to the bottom of the oil pan, or your pump is sucking air.
Jon mentioned the oil gallery plugs. Try the drill driven pump and see if oil is getting to the rocker arms. If there's a plug missing, I'd bet oil won't get to the rockers.
Or drain your oil and see if it looks metallic.
I once had a pump that wasn't machined properly and it would not seat flush to the block. I had to grind a relief. I believe Melling had some pumps get out with this defect, but that was 10 years ago.
Hope it's an easy solution, good luck!
Edit: The oil filter adapter contains a bypass valve, not the pressure relief valve.
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I took the distributor out today and drove the pump using a drive tool powered by a drill motor. Peak pressure on the gage was 30 PSI and I was expecting 40-60. Also, when turning the oil pump drive by hand, it feels like it sticks or drags a little at several points in one rotation. I discussed this with Carmen and he's convinced the pump is the problem. So it looks like I'll be tackling the pump change next week. The pump in the engine now is an aftermarket pump that Carmen modified to produce higher pressure. The pump that will replace it is an original pump that he has rebuilt and modified for higher pressure. He prefers the performance of the old pumps to that from the aftermarket ones.
The one interesting thing that I don't understand is that when driving the pump with the drill motor, even though pressure was lower than expected, the gage wasn't fluttering like it does when the engine is running. I don't have a rationale for that one.....
I've also ordered an oil filter cutter so that I can see if there is any telltale debris in the original filter from break in that might indicate other problems in the engine. This was a Carmen suggestion that I think was a good one!
Stay tuned.....
Chuck
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The story continues.
What RPM does your drill turn at?
Pondering here. The distributor turns at one half the crankshaft RPM of a four cycle engine. So would a 600 RPM drill generate the equivalent of 1200 engine RPM?
I do remember testing with a drill puts a fair load on a drill.
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Righto; but a 600 rpm idle is only 300 cam rpm. My 3/8 18.5 volt cordless gave me 60+lbs of pressure. Its probably a slipping pressure relief lifting off the seat prematurely. Bill
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The drill speed spec is 1300 RPM. So should be equivalent of about 2500 engine RPM at the pump.
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Dear Chuck, Jon, and mid-60s Buick caregivers,
. . . .
I discussed this with Carmen and he's convinced the pump is the problem. So it looks like I'll be tackling the pump change next week.
. . . .
Sounds like a plausible diagnosis. I hope the pump swap goes as smoothly as possible.
I've also ordered an oil filter cutter so that I can see if there is any telltale debris in the original filter from break in that might indicate other problems in the engine. This was a Carmen suggestion that I think was a good one!
One more precaution you might consider is buying one of these heavy magnets to swap around the oil filter. I think Biquette has one from this brand:
http://www.shopfiltermag.com/ (http://www.shopfiltermag.com/)
If any ferrous metals get free in the oil, the magnet should trap them in the oil filter so they don't do any more damage.
Best of luck on this! :icon_thumright:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Got to work this afternoon and with the help of my neighbor, got the pan removed, installed the new oil pump and replaced the pan. Waiting for the RTV to set a bit before torquing the pan. Tomorrow I'll put the drill motor on the oil pump and with fingers crossed, hope for proper oil pressure. I'm pretty sure the pump is the problem since the one I removed seems to have a hitch in its giddy-up as you turn it.
Hated to be in disassembly mode, but it wasn't too bad. I was able to take the core support off with the radiator and shroud intact and that made it a whole lot easier.
Next chapter tomorrow!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Thank you for the update! See you soon!
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That sure is purdy! Good luck with priming! Bill
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Sure hope that pump was the problem. Sorry you had to pull the motor. Waiting for tomorrow’s news.
Dan
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Chuck,
I think you can disassemble the old pump fairly easily and do a failure analysis on it.
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Dear Chuck, Jim, Bill, Brian, and mid-60s Buick caregivers,
Got to work this afternoon and with the help of my neighbor, got the pan removed, installed the new oil pump and replaced the pan.
. . . .
Sorry you had to take this step but hope this will cure da' patient! :angel4:
I think you can disassemble the old pump fairly easily and do a failure analysis on it.
If you take the time to dismantle the pump, do let us know what you discover.
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Put the drill motor to the oil pump this morning. It primed immediately and with any speed at all pegged my 50 PSI gage. I think it's good to go!!
It's all back together and ready to fire up again. I'll wait until tomorrow to do that so that the RTV on the oil pan is fully cured.
I'm sending the failed pump to Carmen where he will disassemble it and figure out what went wrong. I'll post his conclusions with pictures when I receive them.
Hopefully mostly forward steps from here!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Thats a work of art! Bill
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Thanks Bill. Trying to impress those judges that you admire! :laughing7:
Chuck
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That'll be 110.00 plus 20.00 in costs; pay the bailiff! (1970!) Bill
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Fired it up tonight and have normal oil pressure. 50 PSI cold. With warm oil about 40 at 2000, 30 at 1000, 25 at 900, 20 at 800, 15 at 700. I think those pass muster!
Ready to move on to more assembly! :hello2:
Chuck
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That'll be 110.00 plus 20.00 in costs; pay the bailiff! (1970!) Bill
No, the other judges....
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Dear Chuck, Bill, and mid-60s Buick owners who are fans of "nice and shiny!" :sunny:
Fired it up tonight and have normal oil pressure. 50 PSI cold. With warm oil about 40 at 2000, 30 at 1000, 25 at 900, 20 at 800, 15 at 700. I think those pass muster!
. . . .
Congratulations! :icon_thumright: Glad to hear that you are back in business!
I'm sending the failed pump to Carmen where he will disassemble it and figure out what went wrong. I'll post his conclusions with pictures when I receive them.
Please do!
No, the other judges....
(http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/wink.gif) . . . Well if I'm one of those judges it doesn't pass - not enough chrome!! . . . :sunny: . . . (http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/Laughing_LOL.gif)
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
P.S. Seriously, have you thought about applying a layer of Flitz (or whatever is your favorite metal polish) before you button-up the engine bay? It does really kick up the shine and more importantly does seem to to a very good job of protecting the engine bay surfaces.
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I sent the failed pump to Carmen early last week and heard back from him. The pump failed to provide full pressure because of debris that was lodged in the pressure relief circuit. He described the debris to include several pieces of steel shot and a some pink fibrous material, possibly from a red shop rag, with a piece of metal wrapped around it that lodged itself in the the relief circuit. I'll be talking with the block machining guys about their processing. Not sure where else the steel shot would have come from.
Mystery solved....moving on to more assembly!!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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I guess I shouldn't wait another year for a project update. Not much new visually, except the convertible top frame has been installed along with the hydraulic pump, cylinders and lines. I spent most of the summer preparing parts for final assembly. Cleaning window regulator hardware, painting various bits including the black and silver to the rechromed taillight housings.
I also decided to move away from a “nice driver” fully to a points judged restoration. So, I’ll now be removing the front disc brakes I had added and reverting to the stock drum setup. I have all the hardware that I removed from the car and will be cleaning, painting, etc. to install after taking the front end apart. I didn’t have an original master cylinder or a nice vacuum booster, as I’m adding power brakes to the car. Thanks to John Evenson, I procured the original master cylinder that he had bought from Yachtsmanbill and had it rebuilt by a local brake company. I also had a vacuum booster restored, which came out extremely nice. So I now have all the parts to do the brake swap.
But not until I return home. My wife and I have been residing in Ohio since the end of October, caregiving for her sister. We hope to return home in March. So I haven’t had access to this project for months and have now modified my expected timing for completion. I planned to have it ready to show at the July BCA Nationals in the Cleveland area. But I’ve ditched that plan in favor of continuing to do the restoration well and not rushing through it.
So, more updates to come when I have more to show in the coming months!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Dear Chuck and caregivers to more than mid-60s Buicks,
Thanks for the update. Sorry to hear about your wife's sister's predicament, but glad that you were able to help. Interesting that you have decided to return the car to a concourse stock. It is more of a challenge but probably will be more satisfying in the end.
I hope the project goes as smoothly as such things do and looking forward to your next update!
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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What a refreshing twist! Glad to see that M/C being put to a good use, however, and thats a big "H" the safety factor of the dual path brake system needs to be a concern as well. I'd suppose that if the system is absolutely 100% NEW stuff, with a yearly fluid change, it should be OK... afterall it was the system de rigueur in the day. MORE PICS! Bill
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More pics when I return home. The rebuilt master cylinder is not in my possession yet, but I'll post pictures when it is.
I agree that there is much more safety with the dual MC, but since this will be a show car for a few years, I can add it back later. The red car has stock drum brakes and stops fine. Until it doesn't....
Chuck
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Looks Great so far Chuck! Glad you are going the harder road on resto. I'm planning the same for my 3 speed. I know its a long expensive journey but the outcome will be so rewarding.
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Looks Great so far Chuck! Glad you are going the harder road on resto. I'm planning the same for my 3 speed. I know its a long expensive journey but the outcome will be so rewarding.
Amen, brother!!
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This is going to be a great car! Nice work!
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Your bride's sister is blessed to have such devoted support. Life's challenges can create diversions however your car is still way ahead of mine and your project is still the gold standard for 65 Gran Sports.
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I guess it's time for an update. With the time found during the COVID-19 quarantine, I've been able to chip away at a few things.
Conversion back to drum brakes is nearly complete. I'll pick up the turned drums from the shop tomorrow, will install bearings and be ready to put them on the car and fill and bleed the brake system. The drum spindles, backing plates, wheel cylinders, shoes and actuation hardware have been installed and are waiting for the drums. The rebuilt master cylinder is ready for permanent installation on the vacuum booster. The emergency brake system is all installed and awaiting adjustment after the drums are installed.
I've also made some progress with the convertible top header and A-pillar moldings and seals. That part was worrisome, but actually went pretty well. I was fortunate to have the original parts restored so they fit relatively well.
Painted my shocks Delco gray, added rear coil spring cushions, added the glove box arm grommet, etc.
Had a bunch of parts plated and think I'm ready to attach the remaining parts to the car. It will be slowly though. Deadlines, such as BCA and AACA meets have evaporated, so I'm enjoying the remainder of the ride without the urge to rush and cut corners. And that's a good feeling.
All for now.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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A pillar, windshield header and visor mount pictures.
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Everything looks really great - especially that windshield assembly. Sweet.
Dan
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Yes, looking great!
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Chuck you're moving along nicely, it looks great. I just got a door installed, installing it took 20 minutes, getting it alined and adjusted took 8 hours. Nice to have the artesian three steps ahead, when I have a questions I know who to call.
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Looking very nice chuck . Your on the home run stretch by the looks of it .
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Yes Sir! That green machine is looking nice!
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Keep up the good work Chuck! :hello2:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Vinnie wants more pictures, so here are a couple. Got the brake drums installed. Ready to add fluid and bleed the system. E-brake cables are installed and adjusted. About ready to start installing quarter windows. Stainless trims have all been polished and will continue to install them as I go. Rear wheel well trims to be installed soon.
All for now. Stay tuned, I hope to share more soon!
A glorious, if cold, weekend to all!!
:cheers2:
Chuck
PS: I decided to paint the drum faces black. Since the Assembly Manual calls for paint on the faces, I decided black would be appropriate. Should look good when the wheels are installed. Got the paint to restore them soon.
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Chuck, the progress looks impressive. When all this stuff around us settles down looks like a visit is in order. Will have to roundup Kevin and make a trip.
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You'll be welcome any time. Bring JD with you... :laughing7:
Chuck
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I don't think that he would survive the trip up or would not be making the trip back. I am sure that you would not want to keep him.
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Chuck,
Love your drums. I get a lot of good ideas from your restoration project.
Could you enlighten me to what you used for your front sway. I plan on using my original sway bar in my Gran Sport which is 15/16th in diameter, but I am having problems finding the correct bushings. I ordered Moog K5241 but they 3/4 in diameter and are no where near correct, Too tall and too narrow for the original brackets. Any help would be appreciated!
JimL
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Jim , the front sway bar bushings I used on my car are part # 388294 and they should have 4 ribs on them . That is the GM part # for our gran sports with the 15/16 sway bar .
There is a guy on e bay selling 6 of them all NOS , he has a starting bid of 34.99 with no bids yet and they go off in about 9 1/2 hours . I bet if a guy waits till the end and bids you could get them for his starting bid .
I'm sure you could sell the other 4 really easy if you didn't want them all . If your not interested in them let me know and ill throw a bid on them and we can split them up .
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Got all my stainless back after polishing and needed some incentive. Mocked up a rear wheel for a vision of the future. I think I'm going to like it!
Going to restore the wheel centers and clean up the whitewalls before installing them for good.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Very nice Chuck, well worth the wait. Once again you are setting the gold standard!
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Really looking great Chuck! Funny, I remember painting my drums on my first 66 fluorescent orange, all the rage back in the day and at the time it looked cool along with the scare stickers in the quarter windows.
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Some progress to report. Quarter windows installed and adjusted to the top frame. I'm sure they will be adjusted again when the windows go into the doors. Driver door is hung. Need to tweak the gap at the quarterpanel. Deck lid installed. Need to do more tweaking with shims to get the fit right. Brakes are done and bled. The passenger door will be installed next and the windshield soon as well.
I'ts starting to look like a car....
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Engine bay
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Chuck, the Green GS looks great, :icon_thumright: I wish I had the work space that you have,
Tony
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That is really looking great! There is a guy finishing a Verde Green 66 GS too. Would be need to get these cars together some time!
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Verde Green 66. Camera makes the color look off.
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Chuck , your car is looking absolutely stunning . I can't wait to see it in person . Keep up the great work !
There are truly a bunch of very talented people on this forum . :thumbsup:
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Guys, the only thing better than seeing Chucks car on the computer screen is to have seen it in person. It truly is the definition of attention to detail.
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Most excellent !
Dan
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Thanks Guys! I'm blushing.... :sunny:
A labor of love, as you know!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Chuck, the Green GS looks great, :icon_thumright:
x2!
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Chuck
And so it continues
Wow
Milton
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A little more progress to report. Both doors and all glass are installed, including the just finished windshield. Took the deck lid off to buff it out again as my painter friend isn't happy with it. It goes into the trailer tomorrow and off to get the convertible top installed on Tuesday.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Thanks for the update Chuck!
I glad to see this project progressing! :thumbsup:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Chuck, it looks fantastic you are making great progress. And the red convertible looks great sitting next to it :thumbsup:
My red (Shuman) GS is now waiting to get into the Body Shop for final body work & paint. The shop has several vintage cars that they need to paint before the GS can go in so I'm playing the waiting game .. :icon_scratch:
Tony
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Great work as usual Chuck! Very nice!
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That car is looking better than any that ever rolled off the assembly line. You did very well finding a guy to talk into the paint work. You can not find any shops around here that do that level of quality unless they work at home. Everyone is too busy with insurance repairs to put the time into a whole car. This will be one of the nicest in existence when it is completed. A lot of guys watch the restoration shows on TV, but they never show anyone that is capable of doing a correct restoration that actually uses the right stuff and this type of craftsmanship.
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Slowly making progress. Convertible top has been installed. Now I can resume work as time allows!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Very Nice looking! That white top really makes the green stand out. Good contrast of colors. The white looks glorious when new.
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That just looks great!
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Thanks for the update Chuck! :hello2: Definitely looking good! :sunny:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Thank you for taking the time to add all the updates.
The work is absolutely beautiful. Great color combo.
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Chuck , Its looking great . i,m getting back on mine starting in dec. , looks like I have A LOT of catching up to do .
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Looking good Chuck.
Just finished installing my one piece trunk floor.
What did you use for trunk splatter paint?
Nice shop!
JimL
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Thanks all!
Jim, the trunk spatter paint used was Zolatone Medusa Gray.
A great weekend to all!!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Gosh, is it March already? After taking time off to endure the Polar Vortex and to work in my basement, there's a little progress to report. The deck lid has been reinstalled and I think I have finally ground enough metal out of the lock retainer so that it no longer eats paint on the body :angry5:
The fenders have been repolished and assembled to the inner fenders. And yes, I remembered to install the ventiports before doing that :hello2:.
I found I somehow have the wrong fasteners to install the inner fenders, so am waiting for an order from AMK to resume work on the front of the car. Sent a few pieces out for rechroming a few weeks ago also.
Next update will hopefully show fenders installed!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Those fenders look great. That Verde Green is an amazing color. Can't wait to see it all together, and a video of your first drive out of the garage!
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Beautiful! Who sprayed it again?
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Thanks for the update Chuck! :icon_thumright:
Those fenders are beautiful and so shiny! :sunny:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Chuck , Those fenders look great !!! I'm really liking that color a lot .
Bet your getting excited .
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Yes, I'm getting excited to get the project finished. And before the BCA Nats in July. Jim, the paint was done by my 81 year old local friend Dick Lackey. One of his endearing characteristics he would call "being persnickity". His attention to detail shows.
Thanks for the comments. I hope to update soon.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Finally, some more progress to report. Deck lid installed as well as the trunk seal, lock and emblem. I fought it all the way to get the lock retainer to stop eating paint on the body. I achieved that goal, but it still puts a heck of an indentation into the trunk seal...
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Got the fenders installed yesterday. The driver side I'm happy with. The passenger side, not so much. That fender will be coming off tomorrow to have access to move the door forward. Hate to take it off, but can't live with that wide gap between the door and fender....
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And here is some eye candy. The replated air cleaner lid with a new Super Wildcat emblem. Thanks Loren for that finishing touch!!
Hoping to get the engine bay finished soon as well as getting the hood installed. Then on to finishing the front end.
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I also got my tail light housings painted, so the rear can go together as well. Feels like I've just removed a bunch of barriers to progress. Looking forward to race to the finish line. But it will be more of a jog, since the BCA Nationals have been cancelled....
:cheers2:
Chuck
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WOW! That color green with those orangish-red Gran Sport Emblems...what a fantastic color combination. A 4-speed with A/C, dual-quads, no doubt will be a more perfect car than GM could ever have built in their factories at the time. How precious. Are you ever going to risk driving it beyond the end of your driveway? Just a magnificent restoration, Chuck. It is simply awesome.
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Finally, some more progress to report. Deck lid installed as well as the trunk seal, lock and emblem. I fought it all the way to get the lock retainer to stop eating paint on the body. I achieved that goal, but it still puts a heck of an indentation into the trunk seal...
Great fight glad you won. Very nice fit all around on the outside and who cares about the inside.
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The air cleaner looks superb Chuck!
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The package is coming together. Goods great. Kevin and I need the get up to see it.
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And here is some eye candy. The replated air cleaner lid with a new Super Wildcat emblem. Thanks Loren for that finishing touch!!
Hoping to get the engine bay finished soon as well as getting the hood installed. Then on to finishing the front end.
You are very welcome Chuck! The emblem looks much better on your restored air cleaner than it did on my desk for over 30 years. lol
Loren
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Really looks great Chuck! And your painter does great work.
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Thanks for the comments guys. I'm really excited to see it coming together.
Today the passenger fender came off and we adjusted the door as far forward as we could without hampering the fit of the ventilator to the door opening. The gap is still a wee bit larger than I'd like, but it's better than it was and I can live with it. Still probably better than they did in the factory. :thumbsup:
Added a little more bling to the wheel opening and it's starting to look like an actual 65 GS.
Also started installing items in the engine bay. Man that feels good!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Holy moly! That there green machine sure looks nice!
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Chuck , She's a beauty ! Thats like seeing a super model walk by while sitting on a park bench . :love4:
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Stunning! A scantily clad model at that. A real labor of love; your first post was January 2015. Hope to see it soon.
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Yep, my 65th birthday was the day I chose to start restoration of the 65 GS. Lots of fits and starts, but I think there is light shining at the end of the tunnel....
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Great work Chuck!!! :icon_thumright:
As you say, easily better than what came out of the factory!
Thanks for sharing the pride and joy of your labors with us!
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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I seem to be building a bit of momentum. Finished installation of the AC system, the cross braces, hood latch support, headlights, grille and headlight doors. Moving on to the rear to install the taillights. Gonna go slow with that lest I break something precious.
The hood will go on as soon as my painter is available to do a final buff and install. Trunk mat, jack, spare tire, bumpers and then finally getting into the interior installation. My collection of parts waiting for installation is dwindling!
Cheers!
Chuck
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Wow Chuck, this car will be ready for the GS Nationals at the rate you are going!
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Your momentum is rocking...car looks fantastic. Very nice attention to detail. :cheers2:
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Chuck, you’re making me look bad, my entire front clip is still hanging from the overhead in the shop.
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Chuck
Thanks for all the detailed pictures.
You have answered several question I didn't even know I had.
Congratulation on such a well done restoration!
You have moved mountains since last time I seen the car at your place.
Milton
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Latest update...several big steps forward. First, the hood is on.
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The front bumper and rocker moldings are on...
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And the rear bumper is on.
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You'll note in that last set of pictures that the tail light housings are not installed. That's my big step backwards. I installed them and then checked the fit of the center tri-shield emblem and found it does not fit. It's as if the rechroming of the tail light housings and the emblem have created interference in the fit of the emblem to the housings. I've tried adjusting the locations of the housings within the range that is possible, but in the end, it appears that some chrome will have to be removed from small, select areas of the housings to make the emblem fit. I took them off the car and am researching possible ways to precisely remove chrome. Not sure my nerves are up to it. I'll keep you posted on what I come up with. If you guys have any experience or ideas, I'd love to hear them.
Cheers!
Chuck
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PS: I'm hoping to overcome this problem and finish the restoration in time to take it to the AACA Central National Meet in Auburn, IN on July 2-3. Based on current status, that should be doable if I can get the rear emblem to fit the tail light housings. Meanwhile, I'll be working on the interior. Drilled holes for the rear seat belts that will be installed. I need to check the BCA judging rules to see if they allow current safety features to be incorporated. If not, I'll hide them under the rear seat until the car takes its first road trip.
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Wow ! Chuck looks spectacular! You have any other centers to try? I know
on my one GS I had to try like three or four different ones!
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Thanks Jon. I have one other emblem to try, but it doesn't fit any better and hasn't been restored so I really want to use the one I'm working with.
Chuck
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PS: I'm hoping to overcome this problem and finish the restoration in time to take it to the AACA Central National Meet in Auburn, IN on July 2-3. Based on current status, that should be doable if I can get the rear emblem to fit the tail light housings. Meanwhile, I'll be working on the interior. Drilled holes for the rear seat belts that will be installed. I need to check the BCA judging rules to see if they allow current safety features to be incorporated. If not, I'll hide them under the rear seat until the car takes its first road trip.
Chuck,
Check the accessory booklet. I think rear seat belts were available.
Loren
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Thanks Loren, I'll do that.
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I did find the dimples behind the back seat to pilot the holes with, so that's one positive indicator....
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Chuck,
I still don?t have an emblem on mine and my tail lights have never been rechromed. Mine fits identical to yours and I have tried a few different ones. I have adjusted everything to where I am happy with the fit of the housings,but I have resorted to egging the three holes and that is the ONLY way I can make it look correct. I must say that I have looked at a few and if it fits nice it?s because someone made it fit.
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Chuck Sorry I'm a little late to the party. Congratulations on the green convertible, you are making fantastic progress. Keep up the momentum and you will make it to the AACA meet. If you need to try other rear emblems for a better fit I have several in my stash of parts that I could send out to you so you can attend the meet without any worries. Just let me know..
Tony :thumbsup:
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A little progress to report. Spent a tedious day installing window fuzzies on the interior panels. I used the staples that came with the Cat's Whiskers fuzzies. I'm happy with the result, but don't want to do that job again. Makes my back and head hurt!! :BangHead:
No go on the rear emblem yet. Almost convinced I'll have to try to flatten the flanges at the ends of the housings. But not up for that yet. Have a consultant scheduled for tomorrow and hoping he will bring some magic to the process!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Chuck Sorry I'm a little late to the party. Congratulations on the green convertible, you are making fantastic progress. Keep up the momentum and you will make it to the AACA meet. If you need to try other rear emblems for a better fit I have several in my stash of parts that I could send out to you so you can attend the meet without any worries. Just let me know..
Tony :thumbsup:
Thanks for the offer Tony. I've got an extra or two here and they fit even worse than the one that's been rechromed and intended for the restoration. I really think I've got an issue with the angles on the ends of the housings. We'll see.
Chuck
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Dear Chuck, Tony, and mid-60s Buick caregivers,
A little progress to report. Spent a tedious day installing window fuzzies on the interior panels. I used the staples that came with the Cat's Whiskers fuzzies. I'm happy with the result, but don't want to do that job again. Makes my back and head hurt!! :BangHead:
. . . .
Thanks for the update! Indeed you have a knack for sweating out the details! Alas, that doesn't make it easy!
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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Hi Chuck,
Forgive me if I'm suggesting something stupid but really hoping to help you find a solution. I'm looking at the photos of your tail light section and from the photos, it looks like the steel comes to a crest in the middle. On the GS' I've owned, the middle section of the steel is more flat and not as pronounced as yours. I read back in your early posts and you had lots of mastic to be removed and maybe that compensated for the crest. I'm thinking that crest is causing the tail lights to splay out and not allow the emblem to fit down properly. Your work is impeccable so I hate to even comment without being there in person. Hope that helps.
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Hi Don,
Thanks for your analysis and suggestion. We engineers are good at analysis, but in my case, don't always come up with the right conclusion. :BangHead:
You are right, there is a crest in the middle of the steel above the pinch welded opening for the tail light housings. And I'm thinking that might have caused the outside edges of the housings to bend together when tightened, causing them to be pinched outward and closing the distance between the two...permanently. When the housings are on the bench, the emblem doesn't fit as the housing is too tight for the emblem to seat into it. I'm also convinced that there was enough material added in the rechroming process to have closed that distance further. So, I'm doing something I never thought I'd do...I'm filing chrome. Trying to carefully remove the chrome/nickel/copper buildup in the areas where it is keeping the emblem from seating properly.
Wish me luck! :dontknow:
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Good luck!
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Thanks Jim! Enjoy the Nats!
Chuck
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Let us know how it turns out Chuck. Hate it that you have to file some chrome. glad you found the issue. Sometimes those little things are tough to figure out.
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A little progress to report. The rear section of the interior is now complete. Loren's handywork on display after being stored in my bonus room for 4 or 5 years. Feels great to be moving parts from the house into the car! Next up will be the front of the interior and doors.
Still working on the tail lights. Think I'm making progress, but needs more work.
:cheers2:
Chuck
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Looks great!
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WOW!
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Amen! Nice work Loren! :hello2:
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Chuck and Loren
Congratulations to both of you!
Jewelry continues to come to mind at every step with this build including now the interior.
Milton
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Thanks for the update Chuck and indeed another thumb's up to Loren's detailed work!
This project most definitely shows that patience and attention to detail are well rewarded! :icon_thumright:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14:
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It's Bright It's White It's Beautiful!
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Really beautiful back seat area. Kudos Loren!
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Top notch work on the rear seat area! Continued success for those tail lights too.
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The day has finally come that the Verde Howitzer is loaded in the trailer and will be off tomorrow to Auburn, Indiana to show at the AACA National Meet. This is also a special "Buick Celebration" event sponsored by the Buick Heritage Alliance, so I expect to see lots of Buicks there. Thanks for all the info, guidance, encouragement and friendship over the last 6 1/2 years. I couldn't have gotten here without you all!
:cheers2:
Chuck
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The exterior.
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And finally, the trunk!
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Wow! Wow WOW! Shines brighter than a new copper penny! I sure wish I could make it over to Auburn! Have a great show! :occasion14:
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Looks great Chuck. You sure are an inspiration for those of us going though the restoration process.
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Chuck, there was never a 65 Skylark GS that left the factory or the dealer's lot that was assembled with the precision and beauty of your restoration. What an amazing car.
Safe travels to Auburn. That will be the star of the AACA National Meet, no doubt!
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Chuck,
That is a beautiful car, much nicer than new. Congratulations and good luck at the show.
Best regards,
Robert
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It?s a WOW! I love the colors! Great job!
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WOW ! You have finally made it.
It has been a pleasure to have been part of this restoration. Good luck in Auburn, although I really don't think you will need it. Verde Howitzer is a thing of beauty and a labor of love.
Loren
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Looks Fantastic, what a gem! So glad for you. I know you will steal the spotlight at the show. Wish I could be there to see it in person.
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Belated congratulations Chuck! :thumbsup: The car is an absolute beauty! :sunny:
Cheers, Edouard :occasion14: